Why are muslims so quick to ? anyone who insults muhammad?
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ThaChozenWun wrote: »So you want people to respect your views and not speak bad upon your prophets because you believe they are real, but those who dont believe in all the religious non-sense are to hold their tounges about what they percieve is real?
I am saying there is a way to have a constructive discussion without resorting to insults. Just because neither side fails to see the point of the other doesn't mean the issues can't be approached objectively. For example, you could have just as easily stated in your previous posts that you hear the Prophet (pbuh) was married to a girl of six years and that you don't believe this to be something that look upon with respect but you don't know the full story. However, to claim someone is a ? while at the same time admitting you don't know much about the religion you are simply showing that your views are based on your ignorance of islam. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That didnt prove she wasnt, it gave evidence to support its fact just as other people have to support the claim that she was younger. There is nothing in either case to acually prove the other wrong.
Being that marriage and sex with girls prior to puberty was common in ancient times, I believe it. You dont want a negative image of Muhammad because thats your religion so you pick the other side.
lol in that case there can be no proof of anything because each side has their arguments. Interestingly enough the "sides" in this case are all muslim. You are using hadiths to try to make your argument yet you don't even believe in their veracity so how can you unequivocally state that the hadiths im providing don't prove anything? You can't derive a conclusion based on something you state to not even believe in the first place. -
I am saying there is a way to have a constructive discussion without resorting to insults. Just because neither side fails to see the point of the other doesn't mean the issues can't be approached objectively. For example, you could have just as easily stated in your previous posts that you hear the Prophet (pbuh) was married to a girl of six years and that you don't believe this to be something that look upon with respect but you don't know the full story. However, to claim someone is a ? while at the same time admitting you don't know much about the religion you are simply showing that your views are based on your ignorance of islam.
But you are saying you allow no one to disrespect Muhammad. If you tell a christian their ? isnt the right one, or that Jesus their miraculous mirical son they love so dearly and nothing more than a prophet, that would be disrespectful to them. So why is it they have to remain absoulutely silent about Muhammad, (IE the whole south park ? ), but its okay for your religion to disrespectfully call Jesus a prophet? If you want people to respect your guy you have to respect theirs. -
lol in that case there can be no proof of anything because each side has their arguments. Interestingly enough the "sides" in this case are all muslim. You are using hadiths to try to make your argument yet you don't even believe in their veracity so how can you unequivocally state that the hadiths im providing don't prove anything? You can't derive a conclusion based on something you state to not even believe in the first place.
If I take into account that its real and not a man made sham, I can put pieces together and draw my conclusion. I dont believe in the bible yet I can tell that it condones slavery. I do believe some of these people were real, Muhammad and Jesus to me though were nothing more than glorified con artists.
If both are true, which they both cant be considering each has a very different age group, Im going with the ? one because it was common practice during the time so IMO if either were true it would be that one. I make a conclusion because I believe Muhammad was a real man, and that based on the times he did marry and have sex with an underage girl. Again I do think he was real, but he was only a glorified con artist. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »But you are saying you allow no one to disrespect Muhammad. If you tell a christian their ? isnt the right one, or that Jesus was their miraculous mirical son they love so dearly and nothing more than a prophet, that would be disrespectful to them. So why is it they have to remain absoulutely silent about Muhammad, (IE the whole south park ? ), but its okay for your religion to disrespectfully call Jesus a prophet? If you want people to respect your guy you have to respect theirs.
Well if you are confining the word disrespectful to such a narrow definition then your argument is right. However, I believe there is a difference between saying that your (i.e. muslims) is a ? and saying that you don't believe he was a prophet. My point is that one can have a debate about anything and keep it civil. It's funny how showing respect to each other as humans can go such a long way. -
Well if you are confining the word disrespectful to such a narrow definition then your argument is right. However, I believe there is a difference between saying that your (i.e. muslims) is a ? and saying that you don't believe he was a prophet. My point is that one can have a debate about anything and keep it civil. It's funny how showing respect to each other as humans can go such a long way.
Lol basically calling Muhammad a ? to me is on the same level as saying someone who christians have based a honestly completely different religion from and now think he is "? " that he really wasnt. Yours can be true, at the time it wouldnt have been wrong so it shouldn't matter except from the standpoint we have now on what is okay to mate with. If he did have sex with a 9 year old girl, it wouldnt change anything about Islam. But by saying Jesus wasnt who they claim is honestly destroying their whole religion. Thats where my comparison came from.
Ill get called a house ? again but I agree with the bolded, respecting and learning from other cultures and races does go a long way and will eventually have us all united and working as what we are, a race of humans. -
Isn't the islamic faith like 1200 years behind? Other religions were the same way too, they're just decades and decades matured.
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ThaChozenWun wrote: »If I take into account that its real and not a man made sham, I can put pieces together and draw my conclusion. I dont believe in the bible yet I can tell that it condones slavery. I do believe some of these people were real, Muhammad and Jesus to me though were nothing more than glorified con artists.
If both are true, which they both cant be considering each has a very different age group, Im going with the ? one because it was common practice during the time so IMO if either were true it would be that one. I make a conclusion because I believe Muhammad was a real man, and that based on the times he did marry and have sex with an underage girl. Again I do think he was real, but he was only a glorified con artist.
Well as far as the hadith you are using as your argument it comes from Hisham ibn Urwah who was known to have a failing memory in the later stages of his life and therefore other muslim jurists of his time stated that his hadiths were only to be accepted until a certain time period (i.e. before he started losing his memory, the hadith you mentioned was related by Hisham ibn Urwah when it was known that his memory had already started to fail). Furthermore, Aisha (peace be upon her) is a central figure in islamic history and its interesting to note that Hisham ibn Urwah was the only narrator of hadiths who related the hadith you speak of while the vasto majority is to the contrary. Moreover, the hadith you stated is heralded by oppinents of islam because it serves their goal of denigrating it. One further point, just because they practice of marrying young girls may have been common at the time does not mean the Prophet (peace be upon him) took part in such a practice. Of note the Prophet's (peace be upn him) first wife was Khadija (peace be upon her) who was a widow and 25 years older then him. -
Well as far as the hadith you are using as your argument it comes from Hisham ibn Urwah who was known to have a failing memory in the later stages of his life and therefore other muslim jurists of his time stated that his hadiths were only to be accepted until a certain time period (i.e. before he started losing his memory, the hadith you mentioned was related by Hisham ibn Urwah when it was known that his memory had already started to fail). Furthermore, Aisha (peace be upon her) is a central figure in islamic history and its interesting to note that Hisham ibn Urwah was the only narrator of hadiths who related the hadith you speak of while the vasto majority is to the contrary. Moreover, the hadith you stated is heralded by oppinents of islam because it serves their goal of denigrating it. One further point, just because they practice of marrying young girls may have been common at the time does not mean the Prophet (peace be upon him) took part in such a practice. Of note the Prophet's (peace be upn him) first wife was Khadija (peace be upon her) who was a widow and 25 years older then him.
Well obviously I have my beliefs and you have yours, I believe he was a ? , since you have presented me with something that says otherwise, I will look into it more than what you have posted and try to overturn my decision. But no matter what I still believe the other discussion that sayin Jesus aint the christians version of jesus is just as if not more disrespectful than saying Muhammad was a ? among a time when it was widely accepted and done. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »Lol basically calling Muhammad a ? to me is on the same level as saying someone who christians have based a honestly completely different religion from and now think he is "? " that he really wasnt. Yours can be true, at the time it wouldnt have been wrong so it shouldn't matter except from the standpoint we have now on what is okay to mate with. If he did have sex with a 9 year old girl, it wouldnt change anything about Islam. But by saying Jesus wasnt who they claim is honestly destroying their whole religion. Thats where my comparison came from.
Ill get called a house ? again but I agree with the bolded, respecting and learning from other cultures and races does go a long way and will eventually have us all united and working as what we are, a race of humans.
I totally see your point. What is respectful and what is not is a relative matter. But at the same time one can strive to be respectful. I've had conversations with Christians who wholeheartedly believed I was going to hell if I didn't accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior however I still kept it respectful. As for denigrating our Prophet (peace be upon him) that has seem to become a trend to rile up people's own self-interests. South Park, for example, did exactly just that, they got people talking. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »Well obviously I have my beliefs and you have yours, I believe he was a ? , since you have presented me with something that says otherwise, I will look into it more than what you have posted and try to overturn my decision. But no matter what I still believe the other discussion that sayin Jesus aint the christians version of jesus is just as if not more disrespectful than saying Muhammad was a ? among a time when it was widely accepted and done.
That's the point I was trying to make. At the end of the day we all believe what makes sense to us nothing wrong with that. All I was saying is that I don't think you clearly understood the basis of your own views on the particular issue. I tried to provide evidence on the contrary and I applaud you for taking this evidence into consideration. As for muslims disagreeing with christians on the issues of Jesus's divinity yeah it can be taken disrespectfully on both sides. However, rationality dictates that we as human beings assume that not everyone else holds the same beliefs we do. Each side can debate the issue with their evidence but remind the other that they are not trying to be disrespectful of the other. There is something to be said about a man (the Prophet) whose own enemies, who tried many times to ? him, referred to him as the most honest and trustworthy man they knew. Even to the point that while in battle against him (the Prophet) they would not hesitate to leave their belongings in his trust. -
That's the point I was trying to make. At the end of the day we all believe what makes sense to us nothing wrong with that. All I was saying is that I don't think you clearly understood the basis of your own views on the particular issue. I tried to provide evidence on the contrary and I applaud you for taking this evidence into consideration. As for muslims disagreeing with christians on the issues of Jesus's divinity yeah it can be taken disrespectfully on both sides. However, rationality dictates that we as human beings assume that not everyone else holds the same beliefs we do. Each side can debate the issue with their evidence but remind the other that they are not trying to be disrespectful of the other. There is something to be said about a man (the Prophet) whose own enemies, who tried many times to ? him, referred to him as the most honest and trustworthy man they knew. Even to the point that while in battle against him (the Prophet) they would not hesitate to leave their belongings in his trust.
The reason I am disrespectful is that people are killing others when Muhammad is disagreed with. To me that isnt people understanding we have different views. Im not sayin all muslims will come blow some ? up because of it because truthfully most of yall arent extremist. But because there are those who do say dont disrespect our guy and respect other peoples views, and then go n ? people because their views are different makes me say some disrespectful ? at times. When someone goes as far as trying to push their religion on me I will be disrespectful because you infringed on my respect, killing is beyond just trying to convert, blood was drawn over it so to me he's fair game now. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »The reason I am disrespectful is that people are killing others when Muhammad is disagreed with. To me that isnt people understanding we have different views. Im not sayin all muslims will come blow some ? up because of it because truthfully most of yall arent extremist. But because there are those who do say dont disrespect our guy and respect other peoples views, and then go n ? people because their views are different makes me say some disrespectful ? at times. When someone goes as far as trying to push their religion on me I will be disrespectful because you infringed on my respect, killing is beyond just trying to convert, blood was drawn over it so to me he's fair game now.
understandable, but then you should wholeheartedly be upset by killing in the name of other religions/ideas too. Their are extremists in every religion however, overemphasizing those who are muslim is just biased. Furthermore, why is it that whenever a muslim is involved in such atrocities their religion always gets assaulted. Many of the muslims who commit such acts of violence have political means even though they seem to be veiled under the guise of religion -
understandable, but then you should wholeheartedly be upset by killing in the name of other religions/ideas too. Their are extremists in every religion however, overemphasizing those who are muslim is just biased. Furthermore, why is it that whenever a muslim is involved in such atrocities their religion always gets assaulted. Many of the muslims who commit such acts of violence have political means even though they seem to be veiled under the guise of religion
I am, I dont think killing should be acceptable unless it destroys someone elses life. If you take a life knowingly and with the intent of harming them, then you should also be killed, if you ? /molest someone imo you should die. Outside of that I dont think anyone should ? anyone.
You dont know me to well, I blast other religions 1000 times worst than Islam for their killings and slaying of people who have done nothing. Christians ? because they think ? sent them to do his work, they dont like another religion, someones a different race etc...., Jews as well as christians and muslims ? over land that cant be proven who really was there. To me Christianity is the most violent religion ever started, Islam just gets hated because thats what christian run stations choose to focus on in the news. I'm not one of those who see a suicide bombing and think "Them damn muslim sand ni99ers and their crazy ? are going to ? us all with their nuclear weapons" I know its only a small group within the religion that goes to such lengths.
My distaste for religion does not single out any one specific, it includes them all if they involve killing people. To the killers they may not be innocent but to me they are. Every man has the right to think how he pleases, but it crosses the line when his thoughts lead to the deaths of someone not sharing his views. Buddhist for example I have no issue with, they dont ? people who express different views, then again they have no great creator so it may be biased on my part as to why I think they are a good religion. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »I am, I dont think killing should be acceptable unless it destroys someone elses life. If you take a life knowingly and with the intent of harming them, then you should also be killed, if you ? /molest someone imo you should die. Outside of that I dont think anyone should ? anyone.
You dont know me to well, I blast other religions 1000 times worst than Islam for their killings and slaying of people who have done nothing. Christians ? because they think ? sent them to do his work, they dont like another religion, someones a different race etc...., Jews as well as christians and muslims ? over land that cant be proven who really was there. To me Christianity is the most violent religion ever started, Islam just gets hated because thats what christian run stations choose to focus on in the news. I'm not one of those who see a suicide bombing and think "Them damn muslim sand ni99ers and their crazy ? are going to ? us all with their nuclear weapons" I know its only a small group within the religion that goes to such lengths.
My distaste for religion does not single out any one specific, it includes them all if they involve killing people. To the killers they may not be innocent but to me they are. Every man has the right to think how he pleases, but it crosses the line when his thoughts lead to the deaths of someone not sharing his views. Buddhist for example I have no issue with, they dont ? people who express different views, then again they have no great creator so it may be biased on my part as to why I think they are a good religion.
lol I didnt imply you when I said "you" maybe I should have said "one." You're right I don't know you too well I was an avid poster years ago and I dont keep up with AHH now so I don't really spend too much time checking out everyone else's post. Anyhow I get your point and I think you get mine and I think this thread has gotten boring now lol so i'm done. peace and take care -
Because their brainwashed.
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ThaChozenWun wrote: »So you want people to respect your views and not speak bad upon your prophets because you believe they are real, but those who dont believe in all the religious non-sense are to hold their tounges about what they percieve is real?
Your a hypocrite. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »Well obviously I have my beliefs and you have yours, I believe he was a ? , since you have presented me with something that says otherwise, I will look into it more than what you have posted and try to overturn my decision. But no matter what I still believe the other discussion that sayin Jesus aint the christians version of jesus is just as if not more disrespectful than saying Muhammad was a ? among a time when it was widely accepted and done.
You suffer from Eurocentric Brainwashing.
If you ever go outside the Western World even as far as Far East Asia you will see young girls married at young ages carrying out wifely duties. It is not determined by age so much as the level of maturity, which is based on her ability to grasp her role and responsibilites. Same with the boys. Who set the standard for you to determine what is an appropriate age to get married?
And it is not disrespectful to say Jesus was a prophet to Christians. The Bible describes him as such. And some Christians agree with that. There is no monolithic view of Jesus among Christians.
You are bold in your ignorance sometimes.
Most people outside of the US think the American populace is dumb, fat, and disrespectful of other peoples cultural tradition. You do nothing to allay those assumptions. -
A Tout le Monde wrote:Because their brainwashed.
Probably no more than you. -
You suffer from Eurocentric Brainwashing.
If you ever go outside the Western World even as far as Far East Asia you will see young girls married at young ages carrying out wifely duties. It is not determined by age so much as the level of maturity, which is based on her ability to grasp her role and responsibilites. Same with the boys. Who set the standard for you to determine what is an appropriate age to get married?
And it is not disrespectful to say Jesus was a prophet to Christians. The Bible describes him as such. And some Christians agree with that. There is no monolithic view of Jesus among Christians.
You are bold in your ignorance sometimes.
Most people outside of the US think the American populace is dumb, fat, and disrespectful of other peoples cultural tradition. You do nothing to allay those assumptions.
1. So you think its okay to ? little girls before they hit puberty? Now I see why yoy hate white people they frown upon it as well as anyone else who isnt in the ? program.
2. Yes it is, Jesus in the NT and all the ? sorrounding it depict him as the son of ? with all this power. If some dont believe he was and think he was merely a prophet they arent christian they are muslims disguised as a christian. Modern day christianity is based off Jesus being Gods son, if you claim he wasnt you are destroying the religion from the NT on.
3. Suck my ? , not agreeing with you is not bold on ignorance but rather forming my own opinion. What I said is right, if you want to marry a 10 year old and go to church telling them Jesus wasnt gods son and still practice the new testament have fun cause your doing it wrong.
Now come throw a white joke up and be on ur way again. -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »1. So you think its okay to ? little girls before they hit puberty? Now I see why yoy hate white people they frown upon it as well as anyone else who isnt in the ? program.
White people frown on ? ? LOL. You might want to rethink that duke.ThaChozenWun wrote: »Yes it is, Jesus in the NT and all the ? sorrounding it depict him as the son of ? with all this power. If some dont believe he was and think he was merely a prophet they arent christian they are muslims disguised as a christian. Modern day christianity is based off Jesus being Gods son, if you claim he wasnt you are destroying the religion from the NT on.
Your the least informed cat on here. There are many different segments who don't see it that way. There are many Christian sects who operate of the Hebrew Text who greatly differ with the translation of the Son of ? . Besides that is not a Christian based concept. That came from old sun worshipping converts who the early church leaders wanted to placate. Which NT are you talking about. There are many NT's that have different translations, number of books, and arrangment even. The early Christians didn't even have a NT, this was developed after Jesus. The Coptic Church, The Syriac church, and other groups of Christians dispute the validity of a lot of books.ThaChozenWun wrote: »Suck my ? , not agreeing with you is not bold on ignorance but rather forming my own opinion. What I said is right, if you want to marry a 10 year old and go to church telling them Jesus wasnt gods son and still practice the new testament have fun cause your doing it wrong.
No your ignorant because you don't know what your talking about and you are manifestly culturally ignorant. You don't know enough of any history to highlight right or wrong, let alone truth or falsehood. I have been to many Christian communities that don't see him through the Roman/Western Prism. And go head with that suck my d talk. I don't know why you acting gangster. Don't forget ? , you know who did you know what to you know who. Let's keep that between me and you. -
Ignorant question...misguided belief.. Muslims are not killing people its people that use the muslim extremism as a "reason" to carry out their deeds".. its not like no other religion has exremist .... right............
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White people frown on ? ? LOL. You might want to rethink that duke.
Yes the majority of whites frown on ? , as well as every other race. But to each his own I guess, if you like 10 year old ? who am I to judge
Your the least informed cat on here. There are many different segments who don't see it that way. There are many Christian sects who operate of the Hebrew Text who greatly differ with the translation of the Son of ? . Besides that is not a Christian based concept. That came from old sun worshipping converts who the early church leaders wanted to placate. Which NT are you talking about. There are many NT's that have different translations, number of books, and arrangment even. The early Christians didn't even have a NT, this was developed after Jesus. The Coptic Church, The Syriac church, and other groups of Christians dispute the validity of a lot of books.
Did you not catch modern day christians? The modern day christians follow the new testament, it was written for this generation of christians, those who question the books authenticity arent christian. If someone doesnt believe in all the ? about Muhammad they cant be Islamic so again shut the ? up
No your ignorant because you don't know what your talking about and you are manifestly culturally ignorant. You don't know enough of any history to highlight right or wrong, let alone truth or falsehood. I have been to many Christian communities that don't see him through the Roman/Western Prism. And go head with that suck my d talk. I don't know why you acting gangster. Don't forget ? , you know who did you know what to you know who. Let's keep that between me and you.
What is the quoted? What do you know that they dont? Why are you quoting Jigga by the way, hes a ? , satanist, white man ? and all that of which you hate. Oh wait the hyprocritical ? yall stay on. Get on your nas game homie -
ThaChozenWun wrote: »What is the quoted? What do you know that they dont? Why are you quoting Jigga by the way, hes a ? , satanist, white man ? and all that of which you hate. Oh wait the hyprocritical ? yall stay on. Get on your nas game homie
I don't hate ? , Satan, or white men.
Your a white man ? . As are mostly all of us. You get a paycheck from a white man who probably makes millions off your labor. Jigga at least gets hundreds of millions. And please don't talk about hypocrisy. You are easily the most confused hypocritical dude on here. You say your not racist, then you say your racist against rich white men(who sign your check by the way). You then you should get to know a person and respect them but you called Muhammad a pedohile without any proof and used uncivilized, ? language.
I was talking about your little communication to me after I called you on all that ? , ? , ? talk. 'Member? -
I don't hate ? , Satan, or white men.
Your a white man ? . As are mostly all of us. You get a paycheck from a white man who probably makes millions off your labor. Jigga at least gets hundreds of millions. And please don't talk about hypocrisy. You are easily the most confused hypocritical dude on here. You say your not racist, then you say your racist against rich white men(who sign your check by the way). You then you should get to know a person and respect them but you called Muhammad a pedohile without any proof and used uncivilized, ? language.
I was talking about your little communication to me after I called you on all that ? , ? , ? talk. 'Member?
I dont get paid by a white guy in anything I earn from so again your wrong. Yea and? Go head and post what I pm'd you I could care less.
