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Restitution of ALL things

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  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    Because the eternity in hell is intentionally, agonizing, beyond what the human flesh feels during 3rd-degree burns. God wants that, he desired that, to be that way.

    Indeed, as a price you pay for choosing to not believe in his Son, jesus christ, within his these earthly-works that we sopped up for 80+ years or so

    You are unlearned in the scripture regarding the doctrine of eternal hell.

    study to show thyself approved.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    God gave all beings to Christ that he might save them.

    John 17:2
    As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

    John 3:35
    The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

    Matthew 28:18
    And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

    Jesus will in no wise cast off anyone that comes to him.

    John 6:37
    All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

    It is THE WILL of God that all men shall be saved

    1 Timothy 2:4
    Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

    John 4:34
    34Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.

    All those that die in Adam will eventually be made alive in Christ in their own order.

    1 Corinthians 15:22-28
    22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

    23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

    24Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

    25For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

    26The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

    27For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.

    28And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    1 Corinthians 15:55
    O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory

    If the majority of mankind will go to everlasting hell after death, it would seem that death will have won a gigantic victory! I urge you to study this entire section of scripture (1 Corinthians 15:12-58) and notice Paul's increasing rapture as his argument expands, as the prospect opens up to him of a universe yet to be, from which all sin and death are wiped out. Paul's words give only an imperfect expression of the absolute triumph of Christ, of the flood of glory that will fill the universe in the widest possible sense. God will be all in all!

    2 Corinthians 5:19: "In Christ God was reconciling the world to himself." Note that it doesn't say God was trying to reconcile the world to Himself. He was doing it! Study this whole passage carefully (2 Corinthians 5:11-21). God's reconciliation of the world to Himself is an accomplished fact. When we tell others about Christ, we are just telling them to embrace what has already been accomplished. And if they don't do it in this life, they will in the life to come when EVERY knee shall bow and EVERY tongue shall confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God!

    Ephesians 1:9-10: "His purpose, which he set forth in Christ as a plan for the fullness of time," is "to unite ALL things in him, things in heaven and things on earth." If all things in heaven and earth are to be united in Christ, how is there any possibility of an endless hell or a creation permanently divided?

    Ephesians 1:22-23: "And he [the Father] put all things under his [Jesus'] feet and gave him as head over all things to the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all." The Greek verb used here for all things being under Christ's feet is used in 1 Corinthians 15:28, referring to the subjection of Christ to the Father. As we saw in looking at that verse, Christ's subjection of Himself to the Father is willing submission out of His love for the Father. That is the same submission Jesus will someday have from "all things." Notice the last phrase of verse 23: "the fullness of him who fills all in all." God fills everything in every way. The idea of a place exist¬ing for all eternity where people are forever shut out from the pres¬ence of God doesn't fit in a universe where God fills all in all.

    Ephesians 4:8: "When he ascended on high he led a host of captives, and he gave gifts to men." Who are these captives? Luke 11:22, which we have already looked at, tells us. When Christ, the stronger man, broke into the strong man's (Satan's) house, he carried away all his belongings. 1 Peter 3:19, 4:6 tells us that Christ went and proclaimed the gospel to the spirits in prison (Hades) that they might live in the Spirit as God does.

    Ephesians 4:10: "He who descended is the one who ascended far above all the heavens, that he might fill all things." As we saw in looking at Ephesians 1:23, if Christ fills all things, how can there be an everlasting hell where people are forever shut out from the presence of Christ? The doctrine of eternal hell totally contradicts so many verses of scripture. The day is coming when God will completely eradicate sin from existence, not just keep it tucked away in a dark corner of the universe called hell forever!

    Colossians 1:19-20: Through Christ "God was pleased ... to reconcile to himself ALL things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross." If God's goal in sending Christ was to reconcile everything to Himself, nothing can thwart that goal because He "works all things according to the counsel of his will" (Ephesians 1:11).

    Titus 2:11: "For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people." How is God's grace bringing salvation for all people consistent with the eternal damnation of anyone?
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    Will God succeed in saving the world through Jesus or fail?

    John 3:17
    17For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

    John 12:32
    32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

    Romans 5:18
    Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.


    Adam succeeded in condeming ALL men to death so will Christ succeed in bringing justification to ALL men to life?
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    let's start simple...
    Yeshua dying for the sin of the world is not the issue. That's one thing. The entire world accepting the Gospel message, making it to heaven is another. "when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;" (2 Thessalonians 1:7-9) That's a tough pill to swallow, but it goes to prove that, unfortunately, the entire world is not going to make it.

    .


    You say only men who believe will be saved? Well Jesus does not agree with you.

    John 12:47
    47And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.



    Below scripture says Jesus is savior of ALL men AND especially those that believe. So therefore he will eventually save men that don't believe.

    1 Timothy 4:10
    For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    What happens to those who have never heard of Jesus?

    Romans 15:21
    But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.
  • alissowackalissowack Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    You say only men who believe will be saved? Well Jesus does not agree with you.

    John 12:47
    47And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.



    Below scripture says Jesus is savior of ALL men AND especially those that believe. So therefore he will eventually save men that don't believe.

    1 Timothy 4:10
    For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    What happens to those who have never heard of Jesus?

    Romans 15:21
    But as it is written, To whom he was not spoken of, they shall see: and they that have not heard shall understand.

    Well, this type of thinking makes it seem like for those who "hate" God will eventually love Him; that I can be as bad (or a false sense of good) as I want to be because I'll be zapped into a "saint" when Jesus returns regardless.
    al-is-so-wack: Deplorable for hire.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    alissowack wrote: »
    Well, this type of thinking makes it seem like for those who "hate" God will eventually love Him; that I can be as bad (or a false sense of good) as I want to be because I'll be zapped into a "saint" when Jesus returns regardless.

    God knows the hearts of ALL men and as it is written he will have ALL men to be saved regardless of anybodies opinion or belief. This is God's will and his world and his word testifies to his plan of salvation to all men. Many enemies of God will be reconcilled to him eventually. If anyone takes the grace of god as a pass to continue in willful sin then they only decieve their own heart and like the scriptures state they might not take part in the 1ST ressurrection But just becuz someone might not take place in the 1st ressurrection does not mean they will never be ressurrected. The scripture says that even things in heaven will be eventually be reconciled to god. The only things that "were" in heaven is Satan and his angles.

    Colossians 1:21-25
    21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

    22In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

    Romans 5:10
    For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

    1 John 3:20
    For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

    Psalm 44:21
    Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    alissowack wrote: »
    Well, this type of thinking makes it seem like for those who "hate" God will eventually love Him; that I can be as bad (or a false sense of good) as I want to be because I'll be zapped into a "saint" when Jesus returns regardless.


    Luke 1:37
    For with God nothing shall be impossible.


    Paul "hated" Jesus and his followers and obtained mercy in his UNBELIEF and instantly became an Apostle of God so what makes you think nobody else will obtain mercy in there unbelief?

    Paul even goes on to say that he is "chief of sinners" So if a self proclaimed "chief of sinners" obtains mercy how much more will anyone else obtain mercy?

    Also the only reason Paul stopped being a persecuter of Christians is becuz Jesus came to him with a vision and chose him... There are billions of people that were never as lucky as Paul to recieve a vision from Jesus in there sins so that they would believe. Paul only believed because he was given a vision.

    1 Timothy 1:12-15
    12And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;

    13Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.

    14And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

    15This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
    =====================================================================================

    The scripture below is directed toward the descedents of Israel and it says God will save ALL in unbelief.

    Romans 11:30-36
    30For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:

    31Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

    32For God hath concluded them ALL in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon ALL.

    33O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

    34For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?

    35Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?

    36For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.

    ======================================================================
  • alissowackalissowack Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    God knows the hearts of ALL men and as it is written he will have ALL men to be saved regardless of anybodies opinion or belief. This is God's will and his world and his word testifies to his plan of salvation to all men. Many enemies of God will be reconcilled to him eventually. If anyone takes the grace of god as a pass to continue in willful sin then they only decieve their own heart and like the scriptures state they might not take part in the 1ST ressurrection But just becuz someone might not take place in the 1st ressurrection does not mean they will never be ressurrected. The scripture says that even things in heaven will be eventually be reconciled to god. The only things that "were" in heaven is Satan and his angles.

    Colossians 1:21-25
    21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

    22In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

    Romans 5:10
    For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

    1 John 3:20
    For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

    Psalm 44:21
    Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart.

    When I think of Jesus's Life, Death and Ressurection, it was something that happened once and for all; that His Ressurection was not some two part event. Jesus was dead and then was made alive. Because of sin...we are dead. There is no second chance.

    Just so if don't seem as if it all falls on you but...what would make us think that we know what God means by what He says? What would make dead hearts have a fighting chance to comprehend the infinite liveliness of God?
    al-is-so-wack: Deplorable for hire.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    alissowack wrote: »
    When I think of Jesus's Life, Death and Ressurection, it was something that happened once and for all; that His Ressurection was not some two part event. Jesus was dead and then was made alive. Because of sin...we are dead. There is no second chance.

    Just so if don't seem as if it all falls on you but...what would make us think that we know what God means by what He says? What would make dead hearts have a fighting chance to comprehend the infinite liveliness of God?

    lol ofcourse there is no 2nd chance, Jesus finished the job already once for ALL. Just maybe God will allow you to roast in hell for all eternity?


    If you believe ALL men died in Adam what prevents you from belieivng ALL men will eventually be saved in Jesus? You must be under severe religous mind control becuz even the scriptures dont agree with u.



    Jesus died once for all and finished that job. God could careless what anyone else thinks or believes his word holds the truth and thats what I believe in... The scriptures say his death was a ransom for ALL to be testified in due time... Will this never come to past?

    John 19:30
    When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

    Why do you mention a 2nd chance when ALL have been made dead in Jesus the just AND the unjust?

    1 Peter 3:18
    For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit


    1 Timothy 2:3-6
    3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

    4Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

    5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

    6Who gave himself a ransom for ALL, to be testified in due time.

    Romans 5:19
    For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

    STUDY what it means to have a RESTITUTION OF ALL THINGS.

    Acts 3:21
    Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.







    ALL things were created for Christ so that he would leave most of his creation in a eternal hell? How can he reconcile ALL things to himself whether in heaven or earth if you say he is leaving most of his creation in a eternal hell? It seems to me as if Satan and Adam have more power then God under your sick belief system.

    Colossians 1:16-20
    16For by him were ALLl things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: ALL things were created by him, and FOR HIM:

    17And he is before ALL things, and by him ALL things consist.

    18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in ALL things he might have the preeminence.

    19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

    20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile ALL things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.





    Romans 5:20-22
    20Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:

    21That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
  • alissowackalissowack Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »


    lol ofcourse there is no 2nd chance, Jesus finished the job already once for ALL. Just maybe God will allow you to roast in hell for all eternity?


    If you believe ALL men died in Adam what prevents you from belieivng ALL men will eventually be saved in Jesus? You must be under severe religous mind control becuz even the scriptures dont agree with u.



    Jesus died once for all and finished that job. God could careless what anyone else thinks or believes his word holds the truth and thats what I believe in... The scriptures say his death was a ransom for ALL to be testified in due time... Will this never come to past?

    John 19:30
    When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

    Why do you mention a 2nd chance when ALL have been made dead in Jesus the just AND the unjust?

    1 Peter 3:18
    For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit


    1 Timothy 2:3-6
    3For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;

    4Who will have ALL men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

    5For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

    6Who gave himself a ransom for ALL, to be testified in due time.

    Romans 5:19
    For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

    STUDY what it means to have a RESTITUTION OF ALL THINGS.

    Acts 3:21
    Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.







    ALL things were created for Christ so that he would leave most of his creation in a eternal hell? How can he reconcile ALL things to himself whether in heaven or earth if you say he is leaving most of his creation in a eternal hell? It seems to me as if Satan and Adam have more power then God under your sick belief system.

    Colossians 1:16-20
    16For by him were ALLl things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: ALL things were created by him, and FOR HIM:

    17And he is before ALL things, and by him ALL things consist.

    18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in ALL things he might have the preeminence.

    19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

    20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile ALL things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.





    Romans 5:20-22
    20Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:

    21That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

    I have no problem understanding that Jesus did what he did once. I just didn't understand why in your post you would refer to it as the 1st ressurection...as if there is something else.

    I find something wrong when somebody thinks he or she knows what God means by what is said; that their arrogance (or a false sense of sincerity) prevents them from seeing that their own hearts can't and won't seek God. Even the devil knows what the Bible says so what makes our situation any special? The devil used scripture to try to deceive Jesus.

    God is beyond understanding. There are things we will never know by our own intelligence unless God intervenes.
    al-is-so-wack: Deplorable for hire.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    alissowack wrote: »
    I have no problem understanding that Jesus did what he did once. I just didn't understand why in your post you would refer to it as the 1st ressurection...as if there is something else.

    I find something wrong when somebody thinks he or she knows what God means by what is said; that their arrogance (or a false sense of sincerity) prevents them from seeing that their own hearts can't and won't seek God. Even the devil knows what the Bible says so what makes our situation any special? The devil used scripture to try to deceive Jesus.

    God is beyond understanding. There are things we will never know by our own intelligence unless God intervenes.

    I am getting nothing from u but vain bamblings and ramblings... study to show thyself approved. I show scripture to prove with the word says. U speak from emotion. The word of god shows what god has planned for humantiy. U dont believe it?

    Yea, even the devil knows the Bible the same as well as his main servants aka the Roman Catholic Church that came out with a doctrine of eternal hell which does not line up with god's word in the Bible.

    there is more than only 1 ressurection of the dead in the Bible have u not read the book of Revelation?

    1 Corinthians 15:20-23
    20But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

    21For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

    22For as in Adam ALL die, even so in Christ shall ALL be made alive.

    23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.


    Did not all die in Adam??? Will not all be made alive in Christ?
  • alissowackalissowack Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    I am getting nothing from u but vain bamblings and ramblings... study to show thyself approved. I show scripture to prove with the word says. U speak from emotion. The word of god shows what god has planned for humantiy. U dont believe it?

    Yea, even the devil knows the Bible the same as well as his main servants aka the Roman Catholic Church that came out with a doctrine of eternal hell which does not line up with god's word in the Bible.

    there is more than only 1 ressurection of the dead in the Bible have u not read the book of Revelation?

    1 Corinthians 15:20-23
    20But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

    21For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

    22For as in Adam ALL die, even so in Christ shall ALL be made alive.

    23But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.


    Did not all die in Adam??? Will not all be made alive in Christ?

    What good is studying if your heart is far from Him? People can fake it you know (or sincerely think they are knowlegable). This is not a Roman Catholic thing. Our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked. My words just may be vain and worthless, but in respect to God...so are yours.

    ...and this is just a side note, I personally don't get myself caught up in posting scripture because of the fear of being like the devil...using scripture to serve my own selfish ways. And personally...I believe that is what you are doing.
    al-is-so-wack: Deplorable for hire.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    alissowack wrote: »
    What good is studying if your heart is far from Him? People can fake it you know (or sincerely think they are knowlegable). This is not a Roman Catholic thing. Our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked. My words just may be vain and worthless, but in respect to God...so are yours.

    ...and this is just a side note, I personally don't get myself caught up in posting scripture because of the fear of being like the devil...using scripture to serve my own selfish ways. And personally...I believe that is what you are doing.

    John 8:32
    And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
  • alissowackalissowack Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    John 8:32
    And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

    And in the words of Pilate...What is truth?
    al-is-so-wack: Deplorable for hire.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    alissowack wrote: »
    And in the words of Pilate...What is truth?



    John 17:17
    Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

    Isaiah 42:9
    Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.
  • Rock_WellRock_Well Posts: 2,187 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »


    Look the scriptures teach on a restitution of all things whether in heaven or in earth. If you dont want to accept god's word and his truth then thats on you.

    You seem to take everything you read in the Bible as literal. If thats the case then you should take the scriptures below literal as well.
    We are talking about whether or not the Bible teaches that everyone in the world will be saved. One of the two simple verses i posted explicitly states that during the second coming, a group of people will be recieve condemnation; thus the answer is no, not everyone will be save. Instead of directly addressing the verses i posted, you've ran all over the place grabbing other verses using them in a way that pits the Bible against itself. As if one verse will trump another. Thus your whole line of argument is flawed. All you doing is saying, 'Well my favorite verses are better than yours'. The Bible still doesn't teach that everyone will be saved. So there's rly nothing else to talk about.
    beenwize wrote: »
    Now you claim that Jesus did not "take away" the sin of the world? Jesus, John the Baptist and the word of god proves otherwise. Below Jesus says his ransom was for ALL and will be testified in due time.


    1 Timothy 2:6
    Who gave himself a ransom for ALL, to be testified in due time.
    When does a person receive forgiveness? The Bible answers that question, but you've yet to demonstrate your ability to discern that.
    beenwize wrote: »
    John 1:29
    The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

    The scripture above says "TAKES AWAY THE SINS OF THE WORLD" And when we go into the greek "take away" means airó.
    Yes. It says takes away the sins of the world. It doesn't say when that happens.
    beenwize wrote: »
    If you believe in a doctrine of eternal hell then how can ALL the seed of the man named Israel eventually be saved.

    Isaiah 45:25
    In the LORD shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory.
    Ok, this verse you just posted says Israel. Since when has Israel = everyone in the world?

    beenwize wrote: »
    According to your doctrine of eternal punishment god must have failed at reconciling the world to himself??? Is that the case?
    In your view of all ppl included in 'the world' you make no distinction between the 'saved' and 'lost' despite the many scriptures - many i haven't even posted - that make such distinctions. You only proving yourself to be either highly in denial and/or delusional. The Bible says all spiritual blessings are IN CHRIST, the head of the body which is the church. We are to hear the word of God and what it teaches about Christ and His kingdom; upon hearing we are to believe, repent, and confess Christ, then we are told to be baptized into Christ for the remission of sins and we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
    So, your assumptions that all God's spiritual blessings like forgivness of sins, salvation applies to every person in the world is false.The Bible teaches it applies to the 'saved' - not everyone.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    We are talking about whether or not the Bible teaches that everyone in the world will be saved. One of the two simple verses i posted explicitly states that during the second coming, a group of people will be recieve condemnation; thus the answer is no, not everyone will be save. Instead of directly addressing the verses i posted, you've ran all over the place grabbing other verses using them in a way that pits the Bible against itself. As if one verse will trump another. Thus your whole line of argument is flawed. All you doing is saying, 'Well my favorite verses are better than yours'. The Bible still doesn't teach that everyone will be saved. So there's rly nothing else to talk about.


    When does a person receive forgiveness? The Bible answers that question, but you've yet to demonstrate your ability to discern that.


    Yes. It says takes away the sins of the world. It doesn't say when that happens.


    Ok, this verse you just posted says Israel. Since when has Israel = everyone in the world?



    In your view of all ppl included in 'the world' you make no distinction between the 'saved' and 'lost' despite the many scriptures - many i haven't even posted - that make such distinctions. You only proving yourself to be either highly in denial and/or delusional. The Bible says all spiritual blessings are IN CHRIST, the head of the body which is the church. We are to hear the word of God and what it teaches about Christ and His kingdom; upon hearing we are to believe, repent, and confess Christ, then we are told to be baptized into Christ for the remission of sins and we will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
    So, your assumptions that all God's spiritual blessings like forgivness of sins, salvation applies to every person in the world is false.The Bible teaches it applies to the 'saved' - not everyone.

    Lol where are your scriptures? There are scriptures that deal with punishment of the wicked but there are also many scriptures that teach of a ultimate reconcilation and restitution of ALL things at an appointed time. Do you not understand this or should God send u to hell for all eternity?

    The word of god testifies AGAINST you. I am not here to hear your opinion. What do you mean by we don't know when Jesus took away the sins of the world? He did that when he defeated the Devil 2,000 years ago. Thats why he says in Revelations that he has the keys of hell and death. What is the sense of having the keys to death if he will not use it?

    Revelation 1:18
    I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.



    As I said before STUDY TO SHOW THYSELF APPROVED.

    During the 1st & 2nd centuries at the beginning of Christanity 4 out of the 6 main Theological Schools in the world taught Biblical Universalism. There was only 1 school in the world that taught eternal hell fire and that was the school in ROME. What has happened since then? Back then Rome was destroying other types of Biblical institutions than itself and replacing them with their own churches and doctrines. If you attend most types of Christian churches whether they be in the United States, Africa, South America, or Europe you are under the direction of the Roman Catholic church whether you know it or not.

    Sunday worship was instituted by Rome. Why does the majority of Christian churches around the world follow Roman Sunday worship guidelines?
  • Rock_WellRock_Well Posts: 2,187 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    :) NOPE. sry. you already failed my two little tests to see if you are reasonable enough to discuss scripture with the moment you refuse to directly address the verses i posted. I've already directly addressed the one's you've posted prior to you deciding to post entire chapters. You don't even keep your own standard of "SHOW YOURSELF APPROVED, rwarr!". lol. The posting of scriptures alone is NOT proof that YOU understand them or that you know what you talking about. Like i said your very line of argumentation is flawed, so it does me no good to post scriptures for ppl with your argumentative style. and i refuse to go into a vain scripture war with you. So please don't propose i waste time posting more scripture for you when you didn't even deal with the mere two i posted. rlly? holla bacckk.
  • beenwizebeenwize Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited November 2011
    :) NOPE. sry. you already failed my two little tests to see if you are reasonable enough to discuss scripture with the moment you refuse to directly address the verses i posted. I've already directly addressed the one's you've posted prior to you deciding to post entire chapters. You don't even keep your own standard of "SHOW YOURSELF APPROVED, rwarr!". lol. The posting of scriptures alone is NOT proof that YOU understand them or that you know what you talking about. Like i said your very line of argumentation is flawed, so it does me no good to post scriptures for ppl with your argumentative style. and i refuse to go into a vain scripture war with you. So please don't propose i waste time posting more scripture for you when you didn't even deal with the mere two i posted. rlly? holla bacckk.


    :) Good riddance you failed my test from the beginning since you have yet to justify the very 1st verses I posted in this thread. Study to show thyself approved. I'm done wit u.

    Proverbs 17:12 Better to meet a bear robbed of her cubs than a fool in his folly.

    Proverbs 23:9 Do not speak to a fool, for he will scorn the wisdom of your words.
  • alissowackalissowack Posts: 1,930 ✭✭✭
    edited November 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    John 17:17
    Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

    Isaiah 42:9
    Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.

    ...and I guess that makes you one of the disciples; for that was who Jesus was talking to in the book of John.
    al-is-so-wack: Deplorable for hire.
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