The Nag Hammadi Text and The Sethianism

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  • waterproof
    waterproof Members Posts: 9,412 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    Apocrypha: 1 Macabees Chapter 1

    51 In the selfsame manner wrote he to his whole kingdom, and appointed overseers over all the people, commanding the cities of Juda to sacrifice, city by city.

    52 Then many of the people were gathered unto them, to wit every one that forsook the law; and so they committed evils in the land;


    ( Look atthese heathens did to us made some of us to forsake the law,This is nothing new for us and our ancestors they always appointed overseers of us , this is what Paul means in Galatians 4

    4:1 Now I say, That the heir, as long as he is a child, differeth nothing from a servant, though he be mstr of all;

    4:2 But is under tutors and governors until the time appointed of the father.)


    53 And drove the Israelites into secret places, even wheresoever they could flee for succour.
    (Some of us left and Hid so we wont turn to heathens and continuing in our hebrew ways and follow our Father like our ancesters.)

    54 Now the fifteenth day of the month Casleu, in the hundred forty and fifth year, they set up the abomination of desolation upon the altar, and builded idol altars throughout the cities of Juda on every side;

    55 And burnt incense at the doors of their houses, and in the streets.

    56 And when they had rent in pieces the books of the law which they found, they burnt them with fire.


    (The Heathens set up a place of worship of their pagan gods in our cities and burned our holy books)

    57 And whosoever was found with any the book of the testament, or if any committed to the law, the king's commandment was, that they should put him to death.

    58 Thus did they by their authority unto the Israelites every month, to as many as were found in the cities.


    (If we was found with the tanach on us or in our homes and found following the laws of our father we was put to death, this is what the greek heathens done to us)

    59 Now the five and twentieth day of the month they did sacrifice upon the idol altar, which was upon the altar of ? .

    (I told a person on here that the heathens made special days for their gods, and he was acting like a fool)


    60 At which time according to the commandment they put to death certain women, that had caused their children to be circumcised.

    61 And they hanged the infants about their necks, and rifled their houses, and slew them that had circumcised them.


    (Our sisters and mothers who are strong black beautiful hebrew women us is our backbone told those heathens that they will not take their customs and circumsied their male children and the heathen hanged those beautiful black hebrew babies that was killed by the heathens around the mother's neck then killed the mothers, NOW THAT'S THE DEVIL)


    62 Howbeit many in Israel were fully resolved and confirmed in themselves not to eat any unclean thing.

    63 Wherefore the rather to die, that they might not be defiled with meats, and that they might not profane the holy covenant: so then they died.

    64 And there was very great wrath upon Israel.


    But the Kings, Warriors and Holy men of israel with our women stayed resolved and kept our fathers law and did not profane the holy covenant and died for our heritage.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    According to the Nag Hammadi gosepls they believe Yah/Jehova to be the DEMIURGE ? of this material world. This is said to be all allegorical for representing the Sun and/or the planet Saturn... I was doing some research and I wonder why masonic organizations in past used the "all seeing eye" of Amen-Ra who is the Ancient Egyptian sun ? ? And why do certain masonic organizations use it today for the old testament ? in freemason books and for Jehova witness pyramid???

    This is the Ancient Egyptian Masonic "all seeing eye" of Amen-Ra

    eye_ra.jpg


    This is a book from a Masonic organization that uses the old testament ? Jehova with the "all seeing eye"

    Masonic%20Traveler.jpg

    This is the Masonic Jehova witness pyrmaid

    pyramid+of+JW.gif

    This is the Masonic one dollar bill depicting the "all seeing eye"

    eyeallseeingmoney450.jpg
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    According to the Nag Hammadi gosepls they believe Yah/Jehova to be the DEMIURGE ? of this material world. This is said to be all allegorical for him representing the Sun and/or the planet Saturn... I was doing some research and I wonder why masonic organizations in past used the "all seeing eye" of Amen-Ra who is the Ancient Egyptian sun ? ? And why do certain masonic organizations use it today for the old testament ? in freemason books and for Jehova witness pyramid?

    This is the Ancient Egyptian Masonic "all seeing eye" of Amen-Ra

    eye_ra.jpg


    This is a book from a Masonic organization that uses the old testament ? Jehova with the "all seeing eye"

    Masonic%20Traveler.jpg

    This is the Masonic Jehova witness pyrmaid



    pyramid+of+JW.gif

    This is the Masonic one dollar bill depicting the "all seeing eye"

    eyeallseeingmoney450.jpg



    I’m not sure if you are bullshitting but…This is not the “all seeing eye” of Amen-Ra. That is the eye of Horus, the Egyptian ? of the sky 'The One Far Above'. Horus is represented by the famous “all seeing eye” from above. Amen-Ra was the combination of the Amen “the king of gods” and Ra “the sun ? .” Amun was represented as a ram or a man with a ram head. Ra was represented as a man with a sun disk atop a hawk head. So your research connecting Amun Ra, Yah/Jehova, freemasonry, Jay-Z, and Jehovah ’s Witness pyramids is baseless.

    @ Waterproof…Interesting thread, I have also done some research on the Nag Hammadi, but have not looked at it from your perspective. Some of the gospels have been dated around 400 c.e. well after the death of Christ and in the middle of the “organization” of the Christian religion. I’m not sure if a clear cause can be attributed to why these belief systems came into existence, but I think they illustrate how diverse some belief systems were prior to the European politicization and organization of early modern religions.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    I’m not sure if you are bullshitting but…This is not the “all seeing eye” of Amen-Ra. That is the eye of Horus, the Egyptian ? of the sky 'The One Far Above'. Horus is represented by the famous “all seeing eye” from above. Amen-Ra was the combination of the Amen “the king of gods” and Ra “the sun ? .” Amun was represented as a ram or a man with a ram head. Ra was represented as a man with a sun disk atop a hawk head. So your research connecting Amun Ra, Yah/Jehova, freemasonry, Jay-Z, and Jehovah ’s Witness pyramids is baseless.

    @ Waterproof…Interesting thread, I have also done some research on the Nag Hammadi, but have not looked at it from your perspective. Some of the gospels have been dated around 400 c.e. well after the death of Christ and in the middle of the “organization” of the Christian religion. I’m not sure if a clear cause can be attributed to why these belief systems came into existence, but I think they illustrate how diverse some belief systems were prior to the European politicization and organization of early modern religions.

    it's called the "all seeing eye of ra" and the all seeing eye of horus... click the link below and do some research.


    https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=all+seeing+eye+of+ra&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=857l4145l0l4602l20l14l0l6l6l1l258l2645l0.7.7l18l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&biw=1366&bih=624&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=SQn7Tvm5EKHm0QHvmZDLAg


    http://ancientegypt.hypermart.net/freemasonry/index.htm

    http://whatisthepyramid.com/tag/all-seeing-eye/

    This symbol and its many different abstractions shows up in so many places (churches, hospitals, currency, legal documents, movies, songs, song art, corporate logos, ritual and occult literature) that there cannot be any explanation other than there is some unifying factor causing the use of this symbol either purposefully or not. This symbol ties directly to Egyptian mythology and symbolism of the Eye of Ra, or the Eye of Horus.


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »

    I do not need to follow any of your research links..... It is mistakenly called the all seeing eye of Ra by those ignorant of ancient Egyptian gods and goddesses.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    I do not need to follow any of your research links..... It is mistakenly called the all seeing eye of Ra by those ignorant of ancient Egyptian gods and goddesses.

    it doesn't matter then my question was why do certain masnoic organizations use the eye to represent yahweh/jehovah of the old testament as done below or in jehovah witness church. that was the question don't come in here emotional.


    horuseye2.jpg

    Comm_4374_cover.jpg
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    Why would I get emotional about this ? ...I simply tried to show a flaw in your research. Masonic organizations and other groups use ancient symbols all the time, often ignorant of their original purposes or representations. A picture from a comic book illustrating the "eye of Ra" does not help validate its historical use. The sun ? was not represented by the eye, flipping it on its ass and tracing the letter R only shows that someone has far too much research time on their hands.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    Why would I get emotional about this ? ...I simply tried to show a flaw in your research. Masonic organizations and other groups use ancient symbols all the time, often ignorant of their original purposes or representations. A picture from a tattoo shop illustrating the "eye of Ra" does not help validate its historical use. The sun ? was not represented by the eye, flipping it on its ass and tracing the letter R only shows that someone has far too much research time on their hands.

    i think it's a flaw in your research... the all seeing eye is of Ra and Horus. My question is why they use it for Yahweh/Jehovah if you can't answer that then I don't need your input.

    Clearly Amen means something as everyone says it at the end of prayer. They say it means "truly" in hebrew but many ppl beg to differ after doing deeper research.



    the fact that an all seeing eye is used for both of these ? thru masonic organizations is very interesting to to say the least.
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    I did not come in this thread to destroy brother, with that being said your understanding of history is limited....

    Akhenaten banned the worship of the Amen in favor of the Aten(hence the title Akhenaten), he did so because its popularity was greater than his own, which probably explains it continued use throughout history at the end of prayer.

    Moses means "son of" example: Pharaoh Rameses = Ra + moses = the son of Ra..... Pharoah Thutmose = Thoth + moses= the sun of Thoth(the ? of writing and knowledge) It is written that he banned the worship of the calf (most likely a symbol for a moon deity)amongst early Hebrews.

    It is interesting that masonic organizations use not only the eye of Horus, but also the obelisk and several other ancient symbols.
    As far as why "they"(Hebrews?) use the symbol for Yahweh/Jehovah, I have no idea I'm not one of them, but I think that they were more likely copying from their former masters.
  • waterproof
    waterproof Members Posts: 9,412 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    I’m not sure if you are bullshitting but…This is not the “all seeing eye” of Amen-Ra. That is the eye of Horus, the Egyptian ? of the sky 'The One Far Above'. Horus is represented by the famous “all seeing eye” from above. Amen-Ra was the combination of the Amen “the king of gods” and Ra “the sun ? .” Amun was represented as a ram or a man with a ram head. Ra was represented as a man with a sun disk atop a hawk head. So your research connecting Amun Ra, Yah/Jehova, freemasonry, Jay-Z, and Jehovah ’s Witness pyramids is baseless.

    @ Waterproof…Interesting thread, I have also done some research on the Nag Hammadi, but have not looked at it from your perspective. Some of the gospels have been dated around 400 c.e. well after the death of Christ and in the middle of the “organization” of the Christian religion. I’m not sure if a clear cause can be attributed to why these belief systems came into existence, but I think they illustrate how diverse some belief systems were prior to the European politicization and organization of early modern religions.

    shalom brother, just know Yahuwah in the tanach called the egyptians his people as well.... Im will add and address your post further but my uncle pass and im with my family celebrating right now on the passing.
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    Peace waterproof....take care of your family brother.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    I did not come in this thread to destroy brother, with that being said your understanding of history is limited....

    Akhenaten banned the worship of the Amen in favor of the Aten(hence the title Akhenaten), he did so because its popularity was greater than his own, which probably explains it continued use throughout history at the end of prayer.

    Moses means "son of" example: Pharaoh Rameses = Ra + moses = the son of Ra..... Pharoah Thutmose = Thoth + moses= the sun of Thoth(the ? of writing and knowledge) It is written that he banned the worship of the calf (most likely a symbol for a moon deity)amongst early Hebrews.

    It is interesting that masonic organizations use not only the eye of Horus, but also the obelisk and several other ancient symbols.
    As far as why "they"(Hebrews?) use the symbol for Yahweh/Jehovah, I have no idea I'm not one of them, but I think that they were more likely copying from their former masters.

    None of what you are saying is dealing with the question I initially asked lol with the fact that Masonic organizations use the Old Testament ? in the same frame that Amen-Ra was used. I presented some proof of this in previous post with use of the "Eye of Ra" with the old testament ? in masonic books, use of the pyramid for Jehova Witness church, Jay-Z use of name of the old testament ? and "all seeing eye" pyramid. The same occurs in the masonic Bible I have heard.. Also Akhenaten banned the worship of all other gods in favor of Aten who is known as the DISK of the Sun and also an aspect of the Egyptian Sun ? Ra.
    bambu wrote: »
    It is interesting that masonic organizations use not only the eye of Horus, but also the obelisk and several other ancient symbols.
    As far as why "they"(Hebrews?) use the symbol for Yahweh/Jehovah, I have no idea I'm not one of them, but I think that they were more likely copying from their former masters.

    In that case I really don't understand the point of your reply if you couldn't address my question.
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    None of what you are saying is dealing with the question I initially asked lol with the fact that Masonic organizations use the Old Testament ? in the same frame that Amen-Ra was used. I presented some proof of this in previous post with use of the "Eye of Ra" with the old testament ? in masonic books, use of the pyramid for Jehova Witness church, Jay-Z use of name of the old testament ? and "all seeing eye" pyramid. The same occurs in the masonic Bible I have heard.. Also Akhenaten banned the worship of all other gods in favor of Aten who is known as the DISK of the Sun and also an aspect of the Egyptian Sun ? Ra.



    In that case I really don't understand the point of your reply if you couldn't address my question.

    Look homie, save the ? .... I replied because your research and theory was incorrect. You provided no proof of anything other than some pictures from a google image search. Don't come at me after you edited your argument to appear somewhat valid.

    I see that you have gone back and edited your posts to make your argument more valid and less nonsensical. Originally you stated that Akhenaten banned worship of all gods which left the supreme Amen-Ra. Then you removed a picture from a tattoo shop proving that the eye of Horus was the "all seeing eye of Ra" and replaced it with a image from a comic book. As a matter of fact all of your posts have been changed!!

    If you think that you proved anything as far your research goes, you are mistaken. The only thing that you have proven is that it took you over 24 hours to find out very basic aspects of Egyptian history.

    Your question about the use of ancient symbols was answered.... you just cant grasp the proper understanding. I will post where the ? I want to regardless of what you think.

    Ole' let me change what I said earlier so I seem more realer head ass ? .....
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    Look homie, save the ? .... I replied because your research and theory was incorrect. You provided no proof of anything other than some pictures from a google image search. Don't come at me after you edited your argument to appear somewhat valid.

    I see that you have gone back and edited your posts to make your argument more valid and less nonsensical. Originally you stated that Akhenaten banned worship of all gods which left the supreme Amen-Ra. Then you removed a picture from a tattoo shop proving that the eye of Horus was the "all seeing eye of Ra" and replaced it with a image from a comic book. As a matter of fact all of your posts have been changed!!

    If you think that you proved anything as far your research goes, you are mistaken. The only thing that you have proven is that it took you over 24 hours to find out very basic aspects of Egyptian history.

    Your question about the Hebrew's was answered.... you just cant grasp the proper understanding. I will post where the ? I want to regardless of what you think.

    Ole' let me change what I said earlier so I seem more realer head ass ? .....

    What research and theory was incorrect? The use of the "all seeing eye of Ra" is a valid fact and I posted the images for proof.

    1. The Jehovah witness pyramid is a valid fact.

    2. The masonic book titled "Under the shadow of Jehova's wing" is a valid fact.

    3. The use of Ra, Amen-Ra and many Egyptian deities in the masonic Bible is a valid fact.

    4. Egyptian Pharoah Ahkenanten banning the worship of other gods in favor of Aten who is ALSO an aspect of the sun ? Ra is a valid fact. So if I said Amen-Ra at first it's still an aspect of the same sun ? I see from various sources of research.

    5. The use of the "all seeing eye of Ra' for ? on the dollar bill is a valid fact.

    6. Jay-Z use of the old testament name for ? Jehovah is a valid fact as well as his use of the pyramid and "Eye of Ra" so how is that baseless considering all the evidence?

    6. Go back and re-read my first post and understand that your reply was irrelevant to my post in the first place. I asked a question and your reply was not an answer to it but a cry and rant. Lol chill out buddy.

    7. You answered my question about Hebrew by saying "you have no idea because you are not one of them."



    bambu wrote: »
    I see that you have gone back and edited your posts to make your argument more valid and less nonsensical. Originally you stated that Akhenaten banned worship of all gods which left the supreme Amen-Ra. Then you removed a picture from a tattoo shop proving that the eye of Horus was the "all seeing eye of Ra" and replaced it with a image from a comic book. As a matter of fact all of your posts have been changed!!

    That's not true, all of my post were not changed unless I added something to it. The only thing i removed from my post was where I stated Ahkenatan banned other gods and left Amen-Ra becuz when I did the research I found the same story using various sources and I can show the links to prove it. Aten is a SUN DISK ? and Ra is a SUN ? . Aten is also an aspect of the same sun ? Ra so there is no big difference between Amen-Ra, Ra, or Aten they are all SUN DEITIES. Either way that had nothing to do with my initial question.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    Look homie, save the ? .... I replied because your research and theory was incorrect. You provided no proof of anything other than some pictures from a google image search.

    What you see below is not a theory located on google images. It's a fact in reality.

    this is just some proof there is much more, but my initial question is what is the connection between the pyramid "eye of Ra" and the old testament ? thru masonic organizations. You haven't answered that initial question... You only claimed that the "all seeing eye" was really the "eye of horus" not realizing that it is also called the "eye of Ra"



    This is the Ancient Egyptian Masonic "all seeing eye" of Amen-Ra

    eye_ra.jpg


    This is a book from a Masonic organization that uses the old testament ? Jehova with the "all seeing eye"

    Masonic%20Traveler.jpg

    This is the Masonic Jehova witness pyrmaid

    pyramid+of+JW.gif

    This is the Masonic one dollar bill depicting the "all seeing eye"

    eyeallseeingmoney450.jpg
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    According to the Nag Hammadi gosepls they believe Yah/Jehova to be the DEMIURGE ? of this material world. This is said to be all allegorical for representing the Sun and/or the planet Saturn... I was doing some research and I wonder why masonic organizations in past used the "all seeing eye" of Amen-Ra who is the Ancient Egyptian sun ? ? And why do certain masonic organizations use it today for the old testament ? in freemason books and for Jehova witness pyramid???

    Actually you stated that Yah represented the sun and/or the planet Saturn and tried to connect it to the sun ? Amen-Ra, and then tried to connect it to freemasonry and Jehovah's witnesses.
    beenwize wrote: »
    What research and theory was incorrect? The use of the "all seeing eye of Ra" is a valid fact and I posted the images for proof.

    1. The Jehovah witness pyramid is a valid fact.

    2. The masonic book titled "Under the shadow of Jehova's wing" is a valid fact.

    3. The use of Amen-Ra in the masonic Bible is a valid fact.

    4. Egyptian Pharoah Ahkenanten banning the worship of other gods in favor of Aten who is ALSO an aspect of the sun ? Amen-Ra is a valid fact. So if I said Amen-Ra at first it's still an aspect of the same sun ? .

    5. The use of the "all seeing eye of Ra' for ? on the dollar bill is a valid fact.

    6. Go back and re-read my first post and understand that your reply was irrelevant to my post in the first place. I asked a question and your reply was not an answer to it but a cry and rant. Lol chill out buddy.

    7. You answered my question about Hebrew saying you have no idea because you are not one of them.

    1.-3. Yes, Europeans did attempt to replicate and unlock the secrets of the ancients.

    4. You are mistaken about the roles that gods played in ancient Egypt, How could one ban or outlaw a ? and remain an aspect of that ? . The Aten was no longer an aspect of the sun ? during Ahkenaten's reign. (see. Atenism). So if you said the Aten was an aspect of the Amun-Ra you were wrong.

    5. The American dollar contains an "all seeing eye" but not the "all seeing eye of Ra". Again the eye of Horus is the sky, therefore Ra resides in Horus. From this it can be called the "all seeing eye of Ra." The ancients had symbols or representations for each. If they mentioned the sun ? they would use its symbolism, if they mentioned the ? of the sky they used its symbolism.

    6. Your original post is an example of how rumors get started.

    7. I answered your question by telling you they copied from their former masters, but also that I could not speak for them because I am not associated with them.

    The bottom line is that your associating the representation of Yah as the sun/or Saturn with the Amen-Ra through the "all seeing eye" is not strong enough to be considered seriously. If the eye was used by the ancients then the symbols should be interpreted for what they originally represented. Therefore your "all seeing eye of Ra" could actually be the "all seeing eye of Horus" essentially making your theory or research connections incorrect.
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    That's not true, all of my post were not changed unless I added something to it. The only thing i removed from my post was where I stated Ahkenatan banned other gods and left Amen-Ra becuz when I did the research I found the same story using various sources and I can show the links to prove it. Aten is a SUN DISK ? and Ra is a SUN ? . Aten is also an aspect of the same sun ? Ra so there is no big difference between Amen-Ra, Ra, or Aten they are all SUN DEITIES. Either way that had nothing to do with my initial question.

    This is not true you removed the "proof" of a picture from a tattoo shop and several other small details from your argument. I grow weary of correcting your understanding of the ancients. You should do more research before you attempt to interpret and connect ancient symbols.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    Actually you stated that Yah represented the sun and/or the planet Saturn and tried to connect it to the sun ? Amen-Ra, and then tried to connect it to freemasonry and Jehovah's witnesses..

    You must have missed where I said "according to the Nag hammadi gospels" he is allegorical for representing the sun and/or Satun... You probably don't know this if you have not read any of the Nag hammadi gospels. One of the names he is referred to in those gospels is Yaldabaoth.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archon

    Yaldabaoth, called also Saklas and Samael
    Saturn.
    Feminine name: Pronoia (Forethought) Sambathas, "week".
    Prophets:[9] Moses, Joshua, Amos, Habakkuk.
    From Hebrew yalda bahut, "Child of Chaos"? The outermost who created the six others, and therefore the chief ruler and Demiurge par excellence. Called "the Lion-faced", leontoeides.

    bambu wrote: »
    1.-3. Yes, Europeans did attempt to replicate and unlock the secrets of the ancients.

    4. You are mistaken about the roles that gods played in ancient Egypt, How could one ban or outlaw a ? and remain an aspect of that ? . The Aten was no longer an aspect of the sun ? during Ahkenaten's reign. (see. Atenism). So if you said the Aten was an aspect of the Amun-Ra you were wrong..

    I meant to say he is an aspect of the Sun ? Ra so if you say he was no longer an aspect anymore that is meaningless since they both were SUN DEITIES and last time I checked there is only 1 sun in existence. You are just saying he stopped worship of the sun under the name Ra in favor of the name Aten, ok.. See below.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aten

    Aten (also Aton, Egyptian jtn) is the disk of the sun in ancient Egyptian mythology, and originally an aspect of Ra. The deified Aten is the focus of the monolatristic, henotheistic, or monotheistic religion of Atenism established by Amenhotep IV, who later took the name Akhenaten in worship in recognition of Aten. In his poem "Great Hymn to the Aten", Akhenaten praises Aten as the creator, and giver of life. Some scholars have speculated that Psalm 104 may have been influenced by this hymn.[1]
    bambu wrote: »
    5. The American dollar contains an "all seeing eye" but not the "all seeing eye of Ra". Again the eye of Horus is the sky, therefore Ra resides in Horus. From this it can be called the "all seeing eye of Ra." The ancients had symbols or representations for each. If they mentioned the sun ? they would use its symbolism, if they mentioned the ? of the sky they used its symbolism..

    The American dollar "all seeing eye" comes directly from the "all seeing eye of Ra" along with the pyramid symbol so I don't understand the point you are trying to make by saying it is not the eye of Ra.
    bambu wrote: »
    6. Your original post is an example of how rumors get started..
    '

    These are not rumors but questions that have been asked by many people and sparked interest in myself to do research looking for answers. Can't deny whats fact.
    bambu wrote: »
    7. I answered your question by telling you they copied from their former masters, but also that I could not speak for them because I am not associated with them..

    This is why I don't understand why you would reply in the first place if you couldn't provide an answer.
    bambu wrote: »
    The bottom line is that your associating the representation of Yah as the sun/or Saturn with the Amen-Ra through the "all seeing eye" is not strong enough to be considered seriously. If the eye was used by the ancients then the symbols should be interpreted for what they originally represented. Therefore your "all seeing eye of Ra" could actually be the "all seeing eye of Horus" essentially making your theory or research connections incorrect.

    I'm not associating anything with anything but masonic organizations are associating the old testament ? with the "eye of Ra' and egyptian pyramid which in turn sparked interest in myself to question this... There are many other people that have asked this same question and you would know if you had done research on this matter. The use of the pyramid for Jehovah by masonic organization is not a theory its a fact as well as it's use for the masnic book and many other things I haven't listed. So to say the least I don't understand your reply to my post if you were not able to provide any answer to my initial question.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    This is not true you removed the "proof" of a picture from a tattoo shop and several other small details from your argument. I grow weary of correcting your understanding of the ancients. You should do more research before you attempt to interpret and connect ancient symbols.

    I am not the one doing the connecting, the masonic organization are doing the connecting. I am questioning why they are connecting these symbols with the old testament ? .

    Also my statement was entirely true the only pic I removed was another symbol of the Eye of Ra. Your argument here is that the all seeing eye is really called the "eye of Horus" but you are clearly limited in your research becuz it is also called the "eye of Ra" but still none of this has anything to do with my initial question in the first place.

    51qpEoxBJ9L.jpg
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    I am not the one doing the connecting, the masonic organization are doing the connecting. I am questioning why they are connecting these symbols with the old testament ? .

    Also my statement was entirely true the only pic I removed was another symbol of the Eye of Ra. Your argument here is that the all seeing eye is really called the "eye of Horus" but you are clearly limited in your research becuz it is also called the "eye of Ra" but still none of this has anything to do with my initial question in the first place.

    51qpEoxBJ9L.jpg


    You posting all these comic and modern images of the "eye of Ra" does not validate its use in the ancient world....You also went on about how flipping the eye you could trace the letter R for Ra. C'mon Son....I am glad that you are using wiki for your research, it is a start. If you dig a bit deeper you will find the foundation of my research. I did not come here to answer your questions, just to point out flaws in your research that you have since admitted to.
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    You posting all these comic and modern images of the "eye of Ra" does not validate its use in the ancient world....You also went on about how flipping the eye you could trace the letter R for Ra. C'mon Son....I am glad that you are using wiki for your research, it is a start. If you dig a bit deeper you will find the foundation of my research. I did not come here to answer your questions, just to point out flaws in your research that you have since admitted to.

    Listen, I didn't post in this thread to debate with you weather the "all seeing eye" is called the "Eye of Horus" or the "Eye of Ra" as that has nothing to do with my initial question. The image I posted wasn't a comic book it was a regular book. There are many Egyptologist and historians that refer to it as the "Eye of Ra" case in point Asa Grant Hilliard III book titled Waset, The Eye of Ra and the Abode of Maat: The Pinnacle of Black Leadership in the Ancient World." Yosef A.A. (Alfredo Antonio) Ben-Jochannan in his book "African Origins of Major Western Religions" refers to the all seeing eye as the "eye of Ra" so for you to come in here to debate on what it's called is meaningless. I doubt you are more researched in Egypt than any of these well established men whose foundation goes way deeper than any of your hearsay. Also there was no flaws in my research the only flaw you are stating is that the all seeing eye is called "eye of Horus" in YOUR opinion which I have showed many well established Egyptologist don't agree with you. And if you didn't come in here to answer my question then don't bother to reply because this was nothing but a waste of time with you.


    Peace.
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    Listen, I didn't post in this thread to debate with you weather the "all seeing eye" is called the "Eye of Horus" or the "Eye of Ra" as that has nothing to do with my initial question. The image I posted wasn't a comic book it was a regular book. There are many Egyptologist and historians that refer to it as the "Eye of Ra" case in point Asa Grant Hilliard III book titled Waset, The Eye of Ra and the Abode of Maat: The Pinnacle of Black Leadership in the Ancient World." Yosef A.A. (Alfredo Antonio) Ben-Jochannan in his book "African Origins of Major Western Religions" refers to the all seeing eye as the "eye of Ra" so for you to come in here to debate on what it's called is meaningless. I doubt you are more researched in Egypt than any of these well established men whose foundation goes way deeper than any of your hearsay. Also there was no flaws in my research the only flaw you are stating is that the all seeing eye is called "eye of Horus" in YOUR opinion which I have showed many well established Egyptologist don't agree with you. And if you didn't come in here to answer my question then don't bother to reply because this was nothing but a waste of time with you.


    Peace.

    It has been a waste of time debating with an individual that goes back and changes his posts after he is proven incorrect. This is a comic book ? .....
    Comm_4374_cover.jpg
    The symbol called The eye of Horus, has also been written as Wedjat,Uadjet, Wedjoyet, Edjo or Uto and as The Eye of Ra or "Udjat"...... No matter what it is called it represents the same thing... the sky ? Horus.... The right eye of Horus represents the sun or Ra and the left eye represents the moon or Toth. Together they make up the "all seeing" eyes of the sky ? Horus.

    Name dropping Dr. Ben will not help further your argument as I am sure he understood the complexities involved in deciphering ancient symbols. Using the term "the eye of Ra" is generic and is mostly used to describe this symbol to individuals not familiar with the lesser known gods of Horus and Toth and how their duality composed the all seeing eyes of Horus.(? )...simplified Ra. You have provided zero evidence of any well established Egyptologist that does not agree with my argument. Again, the symbol can be called whatever you like...this does not change its meaning.

    But I guess this wasn't a complete waste of time because you did learn a few things about the Aten and Amun, even though you edited your posts to appear otherwise.....PEACE

    Oh yeah... This is fiction.....
    51qpEoxBJ9L.jpg
    "Book Description
    What do you do when you accidentally destroy your history teacher's prized collection of historical artifacts? If you're teenaged delinquents, Aston and Grant, this is more than just a rhetorical question. They've made a huge mistake, one that might cost them everything. Adding to their misery, their history teacher's name is Merlin. Yes, that Merlin, and the answer to their dilemma is deceptively simple according to the old wizard. You go back in time to replace the items you destroyed! Aston and Grant find themselves in ancient Egypt, where their first task is to find and retrieve "The Eye of Ra," a golden amulet owned by none other than King Tut, the boy king of Egypt. Neither of them is all that versed in history, so they have to play it cool and learn as they go. It's not just the amulet that's causing them trouble, either. They soon become friends with Tut, and find that they want to help him out. Surrounded by enemies, needing to survive in a primitive world, Aston and Grant quickly learn one basic truth. History isn't dead when you're living it."

    PLAY IT COOL AND LEARN AS YOU GO BROTHER.....
  • beenwize
    beenwize Members Posts: 2,024 ✭✭
    edited December 2011
    bambu wrote: »
    It has been a waste of time debating with an individual that goes back and changes his posts after he is proven incorrect. This is a comic book ? .....
    Comm_4374_cover.jpg
    The symbol called The eye of Horus, has also been written as Wedjat,Uadjet, Wedjoyet, Edjo or Uto and as The Eye of Ra or "Udjat"...... No matter what it is called it represents the same thing... the sky ? Horus.... The right eye of Horus represents the sun or Ra and the left eye represents the moon or Toth. Together they make up the "all seeing" eyes of the sky ? Horus.

    Name dropping Dr. Ben will not help further your argument as I am sure he understood the complexities involved in deciphering ancient symbols. Using the term "the eye of Ra" is generic and is mostly used to describe this symbol to individuals not familiar with the lesser known gods of Horus and Toth and how their duality composed the all seeing eyes of Horus.(? )...simplified Ra. You have provided zero evidence of any well established Egyptologist that does not agree with my argument. Again, the symbol can be called whatever you like...this does not change its meaning.

    But I guess this wasn't a complete waste of time because you did learn a few things about the Aten and Amun, even though you edited your posts to appear otherwise.....PEACE

    51qpEoxBJ9L.jpg

    You know damn well I was referring to the latest post that you quoted with the book image ABOVE which is NOT a comic book so you can stop the games and save the bullshyt ? . That's why you skipped the image ABOVE that you knew I was referring to and went to the previous post from yesterday which was a comic book lol. You have no base in your argument as Dr Ben has much more credibility than you ? . He referred to the all seeing eye as Eye of Ra and as well as the Eye of Horus in his book which I have read before. Dr Ben is a well established Egyptologist ? and he agrees that it is both "Eye of Ra" as well as 'Eye of Horus." Now go find some evidence it's not called the Eye of Ra and stop crying dude.

    http://kemetichistoryofafrikabluelotus.blogspot.com/2008/09/eye-of-horus-eye-of-ra.html

    THE EYE OF HORUS--The Eye of Ra* -
    The Eye*
    The Wadjet (or Ujat, meaning "Whole One") is a powerful symbol of protection also known as the "Eye of Horus" and the "all seeing eye". The symbol was frequently used in jewellery made of gold, silver, lapis, wood, porcelain, and carnelian, to ensure the safety and health of the bearer and provide wisdom and prosperity. However, it was also known as the "Eye of Ra", a powerful destructive force linked with the fierce heat of the sun which was described as the "Daughter of Ra". The "eye" was personified as the goddess Wadjet and associated with a number of other gods and goddesses (notably Hathor, Bast, Sekhmet, Tefnut, Nekhbet and Mut).

    Horus was an ancient a sky ? whose eyes were said to be the sun and the moon. However, he soon became strongly associated with the sun (and the sun ? Ra as Ra-Horakhty ("Ra, who is Horus of the two horizons") while Thoth was associated with the moon. An ancient myth describes a battle between Horus and Set in which Horus´ right eye was torn out and Set lost his testicles! Thoth magically restored Horus´ eye, at which point it was given the name "Wadjet" ("whole" or "healthy"). In this myth it is specifically stated that it is Horus´ left eye which has been torn out, so the myth relates to the waxing and waning of the moon during which the moon appears to have been torn out of the sky before being restored once every lunar month.

    There are a number of depictions of the restoration of the eye in Greco-Roman temples. Thoth is assisted by fourteen gods including the gods of the Ennead of Hermopolis or thirty male deities (in Ismant el-Kharab, the Dakhla Oasis). Each ? represented one of the fifteen days leading up to the full moon, and to the waning moon. The restored eye became emblematic of the re-establishment of order from chaos, thus closely associating it with the idea of Ma´at. In one myth Horus made a gift of the eye to Osiris to help him rule the netherworld. Osiris ate the eye and was restored to life. As a result, it became a symbol of life and resurrection. Offerings are sometimes called "the Eye of Horus" because it was thought that the goods offered became divine when presented to a ? .

    The Eye of Ra
    According to one myth, Ra (who was at that point the actual Pharaoh of Egypt) was becoming old and weak and the people no longer respected him or his rule. They broke the laws and made jokes at his expense. He did not react well to this and decided to punish mankind by sending an aspect of his daughter, the Eye of Ra. He plucked her from the Ureas (royal serpent) on his brow, and sent her to earth in the form of a lion. She waged war on humanity slaughtering thousands until the fields were awash with human blood. When Ra saw the extent of the devestation he relented and called his daughter back to his side, fearing that she would ? everyone. However, she was in a blood ? and ignored his pleas. So he arranged for 7,000 jugs of beer and pomegranate juice (which stained the beer blood red) to be poured all over the fields around her. She gorged on the "blood" and became so ? that she slept for three days and awoke with a terrible hangover. Thus mankind was saved from her terrible vengeance.

    There are a number of different versions of the myth, and a number of goddesses are given the title "Eye of Ra", in particular Hathor, Sekhmet, Tefnut, Bast, Mut, Nekhbet and Wadjet . The "Daughter of Ra" was sometimes symbolised as a Cat who protected Ra from the serpent Apep (linking it with the leonine aspects of Hathor, Bast, Sekhmet, Tefnut, Mut, Nekhbet and Wadjet amongst others). The Cat was also thought to be able to cure and scorpion or snake bite and was associated with the goddesses Isis (although she is only linked to the symbol in its protective function).
  • bambu
    bambu Members Posts: 3,529 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2011
    beenwize wrote: »
    51qpEoxBJ9L.jpg


    Book Description - The eye of Ra by Dakota Chase
    What do you do when you accidentally destroy your history teacher's prized collection of historical artifacts? If you're teenaged delinquents, Aston and Grant, this is more than just a rhetorical question. They've made a huge mistake, one that might cost them everything. Adding to their misery, their history teacher's name is Merlin. Yes, that Merlin, and the answer to their dilemma is deceptively simple according to the old wizard. You go back in time to replace the items you destroyed! Aston and Grant find themselves in ancient Egypt, where their first task is to find and retrieve "The Eye of Ra," a golden amulet owned by none other than King Tut, the boy king of Egypt. Neither of them is all that versed in history, so they have to play it cool and learn as they go. It's not just the amulet that's causing them trouble, either. They soon become friends with Tut, and find that they want to help him out. Surrounded by enemies, needing to survive in a primitive world, Aston and Grant quickly learn one basic truth. History isn't dead when you're living it.

    You clearly have problems with comprehending what you read.....
    SMH @ ? using fiction books for research.
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