Chuck D "Jay Z And Kanye West's Bases Are "Corrupt To Rap"
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Msupersajinfo wrote: »Chuck is completely right about that.
Yes but at the same time alot of Ni99ers fantasize about being a Ni99er in Paris, France.
Every wannabe white man fantasizes about being a ni99er in a Europeon country were they can feel as if they are accepted by whites, applauded by whites and seen as entertainment for whites....many field slaves greatest desire was to be a house slave and accepted by their Slavemaster...thats why they learned how to play the fiddle and buckdance.
If you are a ? /ni99er with a ? /ni99er mentality then the greatest validation of your existence would be a co-sign from your slavemaster, boss, or colonial master...thats the difference between a ni99er and a non-ni99er.
Thats why some Ni99ers can Listen to "Kingdom Come", "Blueprint 3" & "Watch the Throne" and never recognize that JayZ put a Europeon artist at the end of all those albums...White-Negroes dont notice the subliminal meaning behind that symbolism because they are either mentally grafted and have ? in their blood or suck on so much white ? and eat so much white ass that it goes right over their wannbee -blond heads.
Yall Kneegrows can go dance and snap ur fingers at Euro-worship all u want. Your white-washed behavior is expected and a natural manifestation of what you are on the inside. If u need to build the erroneous straw man that Jay/Ye are not putting Europeon culture on a pedastle then you are either white, half-white, white-washed, or raised white by a white woman.
While you're fishing for co-signs on the internet you missed the underlaying ramifications of this sickness either due to having recessive genes, a calcified Pineal gland or just a white-washed mentality that originated by your lack of melanin, or finesse and cultural understanding.
Hallelujah
PLEASE HAMMER DONT HURT'EM, and if i may add....AND THESE plea coppers EAT PORK -
FlightKing wrote: »Washington_Red wrote: »who the ? can "RATIONALLY" argue with this:
Chuck
"Alright, you have somebody who comes up in a local [scene], at least they should be heard on local radio. But corporate radio and corporations have dominated over that existence, wiping out that foundation [for fairness]. And therefore the little business can’t even start up right, unless it’s corrupt and just totally, violently opposed to what the community is evolved from. So you gotta be national to even make it locally, where you should be local to make it locally."
He's halfway right. The internet changed all that years ago.
If rapper wants to go indie there's nothing stopping them from getting their message out there. You can complain about radio and TV being corporate controlled or you can work outside of that system and put yourself on.
Part of the problem with getting older is that you tend to fight the last battle instead of the next one.
What else is there besides radio and TV?
Internet radio, college radio, blogs, live shows. Tech N9ne & Curren$y are eating without a major label. Lil B is eating. Mac Miller just did crazy numbers.
Not everybody wants to beg and dickride trends just to be on TV. Urban artists barely getting their albums released.
Go indie
Majors don't want to waste money on rap albums anymore, rap videos, there are no big rap tours - because the major label formula was killed because of the internet. It's not a stretch to say that Eminem, Jay-Z, Kanye West, Nas and Lil Wayne DO NOT need a major label to sell their music.
Those rappers need a major to SELL worldwide. They work in the music business. They are trying to sell records. If a rapper wants to kick knowledge or make "art" they can go independent. Why should there be a level playing field for a product that people dont want to buy? Because the message is righteous? Last time I checked this was still America.
106th and Park is the main music tv show and MTV Jams is the only video show. Ratings are not spectacular like they used to be. Radio is not booming like it used to be.
So without that vehicle driving it, what's stopping the leaders of the genre from changing the game and putting the business of rap back into the hands of the ones who create it, understand it and support it (artists, fans and hip hop heads of all styles) versus corporate suits?
Why should the "leaders" change the game when they are benefiting from it? Why should they change the game when they had to EARN their spot just like the rappers who were on in Chuck's day? So less successful people will be less salty? They're still gonna be salty.
? scared of not accruing 50 million dollars a year, I guess...
Yall are acting like this is the 1st ever rap song about ballin.
If they were talking about taking sipping margaritas at a thousand dollar ? table in Vegas it would be cool. But since they left the country its un-American? -
Are JayZ and KanYe West the 'The Throne' 'cos they ball so ? hard in Paris, France or because they make good undiluted HipHop music?
I'm guessing they call themselves 'The Throne' cause of the impact they've made in hip-hop... although Jay-Z might be overrated to a lot of these ? , there's no denying that Jay-Z has done what a lot of rappers that came out around his time and little time after didn't accomplish. As well as Kanye... Especially Kanye because he came out around the time where gangsta rap was still breeding and he broke through that threshold to create good music that ? still bang today.
Or i can give a more simple answer and say, they are just the few of the biggest ? on top of the game right now.
And ? In Paris.. is basically a song of celebration.. a representation of ? that made they're dreams come true.
and ? hating? I mean if you were able to fly to ? Europe and asia every now and then on some sort of international business career..
? would be feeling themselves harder than a ? .. but when you see two rap ? make a song about
it ? feel like that's inappropriate... WHAT THE ? ?
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Cain Marko wrote: »[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_FV7feaE4uvM/TLYNs-ap69I/AAAAAAAAALQ/8UKJxKISD7E/s400/? +in+a+bucket+poster.jpg[/img]
realest ? ever quoted.
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Are JayZ and KanYe West the 'The Throne' 'cos they ball so ? hard in Paris, France or because they make good undiluted HipHop music?
I'm guessing they call themselves 'The Throne' cause of the impact they've made in hip-hop... although Jay-Z might be overrated to a lot of these ? , there's no denying that Jay-Z has done what a lot of rappers that came out around his time and little time after didn't accomplish. As well as Kanye... Especially Kanye because he came out around the time where gangsta rap was still breeding and he broke through that threshold to create good music that ? still bang today.
Or i can give a more simple answer and say, they are just the few of the biggest ? on top of the game right now.
And ? In Paris.. is basically a song of celebration.. a representation of ? that made they're dreams come true.
and ? hating? I mean if you were able to fly to ? Europe and asia every now and then on some sort of international business career..
? would be feeling themselves harder than a ? .. but when you see two rap ? make a song about
it ? feel like that's inappropriate... WHAT THE ? ?
It's one thing to celebrate your success, which is nothing wrong with that...but when you do it to blow up the Euro-culture, in a sense of planting a seed in the minds of young kids..basically saying that when you're doing it Euro-style IS the ONLY way to recognize success to the masses then... -
Disciplined InSight wrote: »It's one thing to celebrate your success, which is nothing wrong with that...but when you do it to blow up the Euro-culture, in a sense of planting a seed in the minds of young kids..basically saying that when you're doing it Euro-style IS the ONLY way to recognize success to the masses then...
I don't think success should be limited to flying all over the world, and going to paris, a big house and rolling an abundance of money, so i agree with you.
But, then again... doing it Euro-Style has always been in influence in minds of north america... just like ? in 3rd world countries and other places think that..
the only way to do it big is coming to America... -
Check out this throwback Jaz-O and Jay-Z - The Originators
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1thvEtGM5M
You done changed Hip-hop. -
All that Nuwabian knowledge...thrown out the door for Europe.
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I think it was the homie black dot who said that Jay-z used to live on the same floor as Dr. York, or same building can't remember.
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Washington_Red wrote: »FlightKing wrote: »Washington_Red wrote: »who the ? can "RATIONALLY" argue with this:
Chuck
"Alright, you have somebody who comes up in a local [scene], at least they should be heard on local radio. But corporate radio and corporations have dominated over that existence, wiping out that foundation [for fairness]. And therefore the little business can’t even start up right, unless it’s corrupt and just totally, violently opposed to what the community is evolved from. So you gotta be national to even make it locally, where you should be local to make it locally."
He's halfway right. The internet changed all that years ago.
If rapper wants to go indie there's nothing stopping them from getting their message out there. You can complain about radio and TV being corporate controlled or you can work outside of that system and put yourself on.
Part of the problem with getting older is that you tend to fight the last battle instead of the next one.
What else is there besides radio and TV?
Internet radio, college radio, blogs, live shows. Tech N9ne & Curren$y are eating without a major label. Lil B is eating. Mac Miller just did crazy numbers.
Not everybody wants to beg and dickride trends just to be on TV. Urban artists barely getting their albums released.
Go indie
Majors don't want to waste money on rap albums anymore, rap videos, there are no big rap tours - because the major label formula was killed because of the internet. It's not a stretch to say that Eminem, Jay-Z, Kanye West, Nas and Lil Wayne DO NOT need a major label to sell their music.
Those rappers need a major to SELL worldwide. They work in the music business. They are trying to sell records. If a rapper wants to kick knowledge or make "art" they can go independent. Why should there be a level playing field for a product that people dont want to buy? Because the message is righteous? Last time I checked this was still America.
106th and Park is the main music tv show and MTV Jams is the only video show. Ratings are not spectacular like they used to be. Radio is not booming like it used to be.
So without that vehicle driving it, what's stopping the leaders of the genre from changing the game and putting the business of rap back into the hands of the ones who create it, understand it and support it (artists, fans and hip hop heads of all styles) versus corporate suits?
Why should the "leaders" change the game when they are benefiting from it? Why should they change the game when they had to EARN their spot just like the rappers who were on in Chuck's day? So less successful people will be less salty? They're still gonna be salty.
? scared of not accruing 50 million dollars a year, I guess...
Yall are acting like this is the 1st ever rap song about ballin.
If they were talking about taking sipping margaritas at a thousand dollar ? table in Vegas it would be cool. But since they left the country its un-American?
Don't lump me in with the other ? . I don't give a ? about the European sound or whatever. Jay and Kanye's sound has been somewhere else for a minute. I'm talking about the fact that Lupe Fiasco having problems putting out music he got signed for making, wack ? getting signed for singles and disappearing into the night, weak ass standardized mainstream music that is the only way that "record executives" think will make an artist pop. These ? rap about issues and don't try to make a difference for it. They got the power to do it.
The way it's going, there won't be another Jay-Z or Kanye West. It took Jay-Z 3 albums to blow up. How many other ? gonna get 3 good budgets for an album in this climate?
You doing a lot of assuming when you read. Don't put more into than what you see. This ain't about no conscious rap or helping indie rap. It's about rappers as a whole. -
MC The Rapper wrote: »All i'm saying is this, with out the fans(who for the most part are not rich or well off) supporting these cats and buying they music they wouldn't be ? . All ? in paris showed is how outta touch they are with the everyday person. Its nice to be ambitious and there is nothing wrong with having money but you gotta be sensitive to the people that are putting money in your pocket . Without the every day person putting money in their hand there would be no Jay-Z or Kanye. We(the fans) were the ones that put them in the position to be in paris in the first place. Respect the people that spend they hard earn on you. That really goes for any rapper/musician you can think of .
LMFAO at out of touch, so ? aren't suppose to stay true to what they live, they're suppose to pander to ? about ? they are far from removed from. If you want pandering or struggle raps why don't ya'll go buy Talib, Mos, Common,etc albums. wait a minute ya'll don't buy ? ? . smh
Why ain't none of the kuffi rapping ? selling albums since the so called every day man is so call demanding it? -
Disciplined InSight wrote: »It's one thing to celebrate your success, which is nothing wrong with that...but when you do it to blow up the Euro-culture, in a sense of planting a seed in the minds of young kids..basically saying that when you're doing it Euro-style IS the ONLY way to recognize success to the masses then...
I don't think success should be limited to flying all over the world, and going to paris, a big house and rolling an abundance of money, so i agree with you.
But, then again... doing it Euro-Style has always been in influence in minds of north america... just like ? in 3rd world countries and other places think that..
the only way to do it big is coming to America...
Yeah, but in EVERY aspect?!
When it affects the DIRECTION of the Hip Hop music and culture then it's a problem. Jay and 'Ye is one-track minded on that particular route to the point they're numb to the core. -
The funny ? about this Ye and Jay argument is how you hating ass ? fail to acknowledge songs or lyrics of MURDER TO EXCELLENCE, MADE IT IN AMERICA, THAT'S MY ? ,etc. Then again ya'll the type of ? who judge rappers off singles, lets not act like all Jay and Kanye feed you is materialism. There is more than material ? , ya'll just chose to focus on what feeds into the argument.
Ya'll be the same clowns talking about a song like Forever Young but totally ignore a song like SO AMBITIOUS. -
I Think we can all agree that some fans are ? in the bucket they want the artist to only write for themselves and keep it real.That mind state is unhealthy for the fans and the rappers that's what leads to folks lying on wax trying to remain relevant in the hood and doing ignorant stuff that gets them caught up.Or fans victimizing themselves.
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Just wanted to say that I did not read the interview and could careless what Chuck D has to say.Also I plan to go to Paris one day as well as other European countries.
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supersajinfo wrote: »I Think we can all agree that some fans are ? in the bucket they want the artist to only write for themselves and keep it real.That mind state is unhealthy for the fans and the rappers that's what leads to folks lying on wax trying to remain relevant in the hood and doing ignorant stuff that gets them caught up.Or fans victimizing themselves.
"i don't be in the project hallway talking about how i be in the project all day, that sounds stupid to me"
translation, rap about what you truly live!
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IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »
Don't confuse people feeling the beat with people liking the messages present in the track. I definitely like the beat but like most of that album I can do with out them dudes rapping.IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »All i'm saying is this, with out the fans(who for the most part are not rich or well off) supporting these cats and buying they music they wouldn't be ? . All ? in paris showed is how outta touch they are with the everyday person. Its nice to be ambitious and there is nothing wrong with having money but you gotta be sensitive to the people that are putting money in your pocket . Without the every day person putting money in their hand there would be no Jay-Z or Kanye. We(the fans) were the ones that put them in the position to be in paris in the first place. Respect the people that spend they hard earn on you. That really goes for any rapper/musician you can think of .
lol...
how r they out of touch when people love that song?
its gets the people going...
did you listen to lyrical content of the song? Are you aware of the messages in the song and the album in general? The gold plated album at that.
I have addressed several of the lyrics and what they mean to me in this thread... so yes...
ball so hard...
and that line doesn't even make sense if you balling hard they not gon wanna fine you , they gon wanna put media attention on you , they gonna wanna sign you to endorsement deals. But i'm guessing jay saying that he balling so hard its foul/fowl and I agree with him He is a foul ass ? .
bruh... bruh... lol...
that line is in reference to the NBA fining dude for hanging out with some college players...
u cats r losing it right now...
that ? cray...
you reaching he got fined for doing some foul ? -
IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »
Don't confuse people feeling the beat with people liking the messages present in the track. I definitely like the beat but like most of that album I can do with out them dudes rapping.IntellectualViolence wrote: »MC The Rapper wrote: »All i'm saying is this, with out the fans(who for the most part are not rich or well off) supporting these cats and buying they music they wouldn't be ? . All ? in paris showed is how outta touch they are with the everyday person. Its nice to be ambitious and there is nothing wrong with having money but you gotta be sensitive to the people that are putting money in your pocket . Without the every day person putting money in their hand there would be no Jay-Z or Kanye. We(the fans) were the ones that put them in the position to be in paris in the first place. Respect the people that spend they hard earn on you. That really goes for any rapper/musician you can think of .
lol...
how r they out of touch when people love that song?
its gets the people going...
did you listen to lyrical content of the song? Are you aware of the messages in the song and the album in general? The gold plated album at that.
I have addressed several of the lyrics and what they mean to me in this thread... so yes...
ball so hard...
and that line doesn't even make sense if you balling hard they not gon wanna fine you , they gon wanna put media attention on you , they gonna wanna sign you to endorsement deals. But i'm guessing jay saying that he balling so hard its foul/fowl and I agree with him He is a foul ass ? .
bruh... bruh... lol...
that line is in reference to the NBA fining dude for hanging out with some college players...
u cats r losing it right now...
that ? cray...
you reaching he got fined for doing some foul ?
lololololo white America... Assassinate my character....
as a part of a nba ownership your not suppose to be taking pictures and just doing ? with college players
as he did with the kentucky players that why he got fined . -
supersajinfo wrote: »I Think we can all agree that some fans are ? in the bucket they want the artist to only write for themselves and keep it real.That mind state is unhealthy for the fans and the rappers that's what leads to folks lying on wax trying to remain relevant in the hood and doing ignorant stuff that gets them caught up.Or fans victimizing themselves.
keeping it real doesn't have to involve talking about being in the hood and writing about themselves.
I mean, as rappers, they've came from the hood to reach the places where Jay-Z and Kanye can go... especially most.
The fans love them when they first come out because they love the struggle and the fact they can relate because
most people are at that stage in the their life grinding just like Jay and Kanye were when they were at these beginning stages
in their career.
But once they start to see progress and more success on the way for themselves, ? are still home crying to the lyrics pumpin out the stereo talkin bout "These ? sold out man, they ain't real no more, ? over here talkin about paris, cars, watches n ? "
keepin it real, doesn't only mean authenticity in the rapper, it can also mean telling you the struggles of a situation that are real, as well as the successes in a situation when you get there, how you would enjoy it, what you gotta do when you get there.
? In Paris...
is the success side of the coin...
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supersajinfo wrote: »I didn't like watch the throne and was one of the first to say that ? had no replay value .The few gems they drop get washed out by the overrall wall of sound vibe I get from this album.Yes this album is Eurocentric and xenocentric.These guys could have dropped a boom bap album with the same title with the same lyrics and I guarantee they would have got universal praise on this site.I think a lot of folks don't like bourgeois vibe that they are putting on it does come across as snooty when the majority of kanyes fans were at first struggling college kids .I don't need for a rapper to remind me every five seconds that I live in a ? up world at the same time I don't mind him telling me that he is successful.
This is what people don't understand but you stated it: THE OVERALL SOUND VIBE.
In this case I don't care if JayZ wears Givenchy, Gucci, Versace, and Yves Saint Laurent, and drives Bentleys, Beemers & Benzes he can have a bromance with Chris Martin, speak in French, move to Italy, and watch reruns of "Austin Powers" while eating sauerkraut on a Belgian waffle.
All I care about is the music and the musical direction of the culture:
Let's give rappers the benefit of the doubt;
you wanna wear all the over-priced Italian fashion then cool
you wanna obsess over German engineering and Euro-cars, cool
you wanna name yourselves after Europeon-Italian gangsters, cool
you wanna sign a rapper from the U.K. and collab with EUROPEONS, cool
All that ish is cool but when your album has a Eurocentric vibe with it's musical elements its only going to neutralize any type of Black empowerment lyrics or street/community vibe that you may want to convey, and then you add the Europeon-art covers, the song titles, and the guests and you have one big Europeon orgy that many HipHop fans ain't gonna feel.
I don't want artists to wallow in self-pity and celebrate misery and poverty, I enjoy hearing the celebrations of success and excess, but is the soundtrack to our success based on Europeon validation and white folks acceptance? That's dangerous territory.
Hey look Ma' we finally made it, we are in a Europeon country wearing Europeon clothes, driving Europeon cars, sleeping with Europeon women and listening to a Europeon-themed rap album about "Ni99ers in Paris".
Yeah, you made it to Paris but you still a ? /NI99ER.
Good point.
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Usmarine is the male version of shadyteamI said this the moment Watch the Throne dropped. But my point was from a musical perspective. Everything on that album only popped because it has JayZ and Kanye attached to it.
Take a song like Otis. To us, nothing about that song is spectacular. We download songs like that every week. But you add Kanye and Jay to a beat like that and everybody and their momma is feeling it. Otis doesn't get national play if its done by anybody but those 2.
They think they're doing something great for rap when in all honesty they're just proving how fake it is.
Oh really, we download songs like Otis every week, where they do that at? Name some songs that's in the same vein as Otis that never got play?
Kanye and Jay gets the hype because they have a track record of quality and consistency of putting out hit records. I'm sure if any other rapper who has had success would get a song like that to pop off.
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UPTOWN CONNEXX wrote: »
Usmarine is the male version of shadyteamI said this the moment Watch the Throne dropped. But my point was from a musical perspective. Everything on that album only popped because it has JayZ and Kanye attached to it.
Take a song like Otis. To us, nothing about that song is spectacular. We download songs like that every week. But you add Kanye and Jay to a beat like that and everybody and their momma is feeling it. Otis doesn't get national play if its done by anybody but those 2.
They think they're doing something great for rap when in all honesty they're just proving how fake it is.
Oh really, we download songs like Otis every week, where they do that at? Name some songs that's in the same vein as Otis that never got play?
Kanye and Jay gets the hype because they have a track record of quality and consistency of putting out hit records. I'm sure if any other rapper who has had success would get a song like that to pop off.
He's only doing what he's required to do.
Most of these clowns are too corny and clueless to even dialogue with, they think the more they type the word "? " in their posts the more "real" they sound on the Internet.....mega-geeks tho' behind that computer screen believe that.
Then you got the brain-damaged idiots that think criticizing euro-trash and euro-pandering has something to do with knocking the success of the next man but them ? be the first ones crying and criticizing Soulja Boy for making millions off ringtones and nobody ever accuses them of hating on the success of a Soulja Boy.
The same semi-literate hams that talk about that crab-in-the-barrell ish be the same simple-minded maggots that ? on YMcMb for getting that PoP money.
Some of JayZ/Kanye's blogger fans are so corny and white-washed themselves that they look at any criticism toward the musical direction of their heroes as hatred so this is what these hams say:
"These ? be hating on the ? JayZ because that ? JayZ doesn't rap about ? in project elevators like the ? that be in the ghetto with other ? , these ? just hate on JayZs money and successes because ? don't want them ? to rap it how they live it ? .
^^^^thats their logic, but the hams have no explanation why "MBDTF" didn't get the same criticism....why is that?
Were were all these so-called "Kuffi-ni99ers" & "Black ? -heads" when it was time to play crab-in-a-bucket and hate on Kanye for his super-success with Ballet-Opera-Hop with "My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy"?
Is their a difference in the overall vibe and musical direction with "MBDTF" and "WTT" or am I just as stupid and brainwashed as the rest of these chumps and chimps that don't know sh*t about music except for what's on the surface?
When that question can be answered maybe people can take off the blinders. -
Yo couldn't have put it better 'Rap
Criticism is viewed as "hate" on these forums
Only females think like that
And if I recall correctly, Chuck D in the interview did not use insulting or hateful language towards both "? "
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IntellectualViolence wrote: »@H-Rap and @rip.dilla
we can all agree that the term "hate" has been over used and misused...
criticism is healthy... especially when it comes to the genre that we all love... what Chuck said comes off as hate because he is purposely ignoring aspects of the song in question that contradict his stance...
I think the most important part of this dialogue is getting lost... the media conglomerates are doing way more damage than this one song can ever do...
Could you elaborate further please? -
IntellectualViolence wrote: »he's being intellectually dishonest by looking at the song as a literal exaltation of Paris and white America...
but again that is not even the point that should receive the most debate...
he is correct about the state of radio and television...
I hope you know as we post that KanYe West has turned into a 'fashion designer' knocking it down with top European fashion designers in collaborations more especially in Paris
On his last fashion show just last week, he had skinny, unhealthy white models wearing his ? on the catwalk. The price tag of those clothes will be out of reach of a huge majority of his female fans I reckon
Dude wears female attires on stage (skirts and silk blouses)
I have tried to like Watch The Throne as an album, but it doesn't just capture my attention at all
This discussion has been closed.