Is there a such thing as “Real” Hip Hop?
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Got this from one of my FB friends this morning check it out
Author is escobar300 (thought it was Nas at first, lol)
Note that to see the extra videos and photos, go to the link:
http://escobar300.wordpress.com/2012/07/14/is-there-a-such-thing-as-real-hip-hop/
Author is escobar300 (thought it was Nas at first, lol)
Note that to see the extra videos and photos, go to the link:
http://escobar300.wordpress.com/2012/07/14/is-there-a-such-thing-as-real-hip-hop/
The battle between “Real Hip Hop” and Commercial hip hop has been going on since the beginning of time. Whenever it be old rappers chastising the new or the new ones feeling that they needed to battle the old ones to gain new stripes. Battling among emcee have always been apart of the origin but one war thats been going on for the longest period of time and thats the battle between Commercialism and authenticity. This civil war among hip hop has created a major division from not even fans, bloggers but also a division among artists. There were times where if an underground artist would even do a song with JayZ or get a beat from Swizz beatz that they “sold out” or “went mainstream” Over the years the extremism among artist has been kept to a minimum but one of the things I want to address is the concept of “Real hip hop” Do a lot of the artist really mean it or are they saying it for record sales?
Many artist have spoken out against the mainstream or commercial aspect of hip hop with disgust, with disdain and such hatred. Theres rappers who’ve stuck with the script throughout their entire careers and continue to supply and eat off the underground. Freddie Bumpy Knuckles Foxxx is one of those emcees. Foxxx may never been the best technical rapper but he’s among one of the brash and vocal when it comes to speaking on weak emcees, commercial rappers and being the savior for real hip hoppers. Never to bite his tongue, copp pleas, or buckle under mainstream pressure. Foxxx been going strong for almost 30 years and possibly one of the few rappers within the culture that will most likely never sell out. Foxxx is one of the few rappers thats been fighting the good war for “authentic hip hop” and keeping the integrity within the culture stabilized whereas many others(Im gonna get to that) seemingly are using the real hip hop banner to re connect with a fanbase that they lost.
Let me be the first to say that there is NOTHING wrong with being a mainstream artist. Hip hop has always been about partying, having a good time, and living it up. The problem remains with the fact and thats also with the rappers themselves is that hip hop has been culturally imbalanced among radio. What people don’t know is Bill Clinton passed a law in 1996 giving the government the ability to control whats being played on radio and what type of music that the masses are gonna be forced to hear. The complaints have been minimum due to the emergence of talented artists such as DMX, JayZ, Eminem, 50 Cent, Snoop Dogg, and many other acts whom emerged in the 90s-2000s whereas now are nothing more than carbon copies of the next persons style, flow, dress code, and image. Many have said this been happening since the beginning but the difference between then and now is that the music aside from a selective is JUST NOT GOOD.
Another problem that I have is with artists that put themselves in a position or on a pedestal that they ARE hip hop and that their agenda is to SAVE hip hop from the wack rappers or the powers that be when in reality their agenda is more of the same as a “commercialized” rapper. Don’t go knocking the next man for being commercial and trying to eat while using an angle to deceive people when in reality you’re doing more of the same. At the end of the day every last one of these rappers especially the conscious rappers are in it for the PAYCHECK.Examples are below:
You have Common who after dropping a dud with Universal Mind Control using the “real hip hop angle” to get his credibility back. He started throwing shots at what would considered to be the poster child of pop/rap music at the time Drake. At first Common dodged and ducked around it until eventually he had to admit it. His record Sweet would go on to be one of the best records of 2011 and had many people believe Common Sense of old has resurrected to save hip hop. BUT once again Cash Rules Everything Around Us and you can see Common nowadays doing hardbody songs like this:http://youtu.be/vYUkq8JAal4
The 2nd one on the list is KRS One. KRS One has built a career off calling out sell out rappers and even going as far as to call himself ? . He spent his entire career going against the machine and representing real hip hop. But when Sprite came calling. The Blastmaster flipped the script and took the check from not only sprite but also from the Hip Hop Antichrist at the time P-Diddy and Nike. But yet he wanted to call out that kid from St Louis? Cmon son!
Next up you have Nas. Whom is possibly one of the most gifted and prolific rappers to ever grace the mic Lyrically. This man is INCREDIBLE and the catalogue speaks for itself but there are many instances where Nas has proved to be possibly one of the most confused individuals to ever speak. Take the Hot 97 incident where he called out commercial emcees, called out the evil empire in Def Jam and talking about how he’s the one thats gonna bring back authentic hip hop when in reality Esco tried selling out MANY times throughout his career. Many would have believed that had it really popped off that he would have continued dropping Oochie Wally’s and You Owe Me type of tracks if it was continuing to double his dollars. Homeboy spent the bulk of his career trying to cross into the mainstream but when that didn’t work, He tried playing the savior angle to save his career and it worked.
The problem with Nas’s statements is while it was what people wanted to hear. Everything that was coming from his mouth was shut down with a contradiction and meant no merit because not only did he bow down to Hot 97 months later, He ended up signing with the same exact evil empire he was condemning YEARS LATER.
Nas going against commercialism and the evil empire.http://youtu.be/xmt19M4yLdM
Now before people rush and inbox me with hate mail. The true bottom line of this is that I have nothing against these artists personally. I LOVE their music and long as they continue to make good music, I’m gonna continue to spread and promote it. My problem with alot of these guys like the 3 I mentioned is that they spent many instances attacking their peers for the music they make and I somewhat I agree with their stance. Theres nothing wrong with checking these garbage rappers out here and making them actually try to put an effort in. The problem I have with these guys is that they at a moment in their careers when it was either fading or the record isn’t selling is that they use the “real hip hop angle” or “I’m bringing real hip hop back” or “The illuminati is holding me back” Whatever the case maybe, It’s clearly obvious that alot of these dudes preaching about real hip hop aren’t above the dollar.
Its like the late Ol ? Bastard once said, Who wants to be an emcee if you can’t get paid to be a ? emcee?
Comments
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What are your thoughts?!?!
I basically responded to my friend about it,
He says that this is what he feels about "Real Hip Hop as well"
Me and him have got into arguments, because I would tell them that what that rapper may say shouldn't determine if you listen to him or not. So I responded to this:
I thought that was Nas for a moment, lol. Then I seen he was one of the subjects. I agree wholeheartedly what he's saying, because there are others who do do this, Ice-T I believe would come to mind too. But the one thing I'm about and the author said it is "What people don’t know is Bill Clinton passed a law in 1996 giving the government the ability to control whats being played on radio and what type of music that the masses are gonna be forced to hear." That is the most important reason why I listen to more of the underground hip hop music. The gov't has had their hand in choosing what the masses listen to on the radio or watch on TV. My only problem with today's music: no real variety. I don't hate mainstream music, I could listen to T.I., Ludacris, 50 Cent, Common, Nas, all of them, but there are limitations in which an artist in the mainstream could go in terms of messages. Nas and Common do get a pass because they talked negative against commercial rappers, then turn around and do commercial things. So I see what the author means when he calls them sellouts. I think I've told you before that there were things I didn't like that Common said before, the only thing I care about is the music, period. Many rappers would have weird views and what not but like the author said, as long as they are making good music..thats what should matter.
Everyone has to get paid, but the reason I favor underground over mainstream music from a rapper's perspective in terms of where their target audience is is because for most part, most of the indie or underground artists have more control over their material and the money they make, especially now with the internet jumping to new heights. I see the author's take on who are the sellouts, and thats proof I could never debate that, but for me I care about and many others care about is that we care about the music and thats it. Thats like for example I go to McDonalds to get a No#1 (should be Big Mac meal up there in NY too, not sure), the cashier rings up the order and then tells me "you shouldn't get the Big Mac, its not good for you". In which he/she is right but two things come to mind #1 I have to choice if I'm going to eat it again and #2 I don't care what the cashier thinks. I don't care what they think because they don't know if I get the Big Mac often or I could be a healthy eater and decided to treat myself. And I also have a choice to eat it again or not, I may want a NO#3 (Quarter Pounder) the next day (pause no ? ). What I'm trying to say is that we as people have a choice to what we listen to and should use other vehicles like searching online for music and not give into the limited choices on radio.. SirusXM may be the exception. And we shouldn't really care about what alot of the "Hip Hop Saviors" have to say, like take it for a grain of salt most especially if you don't agree. Because again the most important thing is quality music. -
there is no "Real Hip Hop"...hip hop is what you think it is...some may think Nas is hip hop while others feel Waka Flocka is
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How do you start your own thread?
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Trying to start a thread, can't figure it out though.
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Why is the writer worried about what some rappers think of the musical genre they're into?
I'm done with these arguments. I listen TO WHATEVER THE ? I want ..
At the end of the day, its just music. Everyone's different. The way the melodies of a song capture one person might not be the same for others and vice versa -
Why is the writer worried about what some rappers think of the musical genre they're into?
I'm done with these arguments. I listen TO WHATEVER THE ? I want ..
At the end of the day, its just music. Everyone's different. The way the melodies of a song capture one person might not be the same for others and vice versa
Exactly!! This was my view to my FB friend who posted it! It's like they want to find a excuse to not like hip hop or not like the emcees or not to look for new music. And mind you, the guy is a younger dude, far younger than me. So he claims he didn't grow up on hip hop and is for Soulja Boy and all of them. We got into an argument over KRS One repping this so called "Rap Religion" and I'm like dude, why should it matter? He's so vocal on so called "Hip Hop Elitist" but claims he doesn't listen to rap, really??
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I think "real" hip hop is when you utilize your talent to the best of your ability to make art... If Crank That is the best that SB could come up with then that's hip hop to me... If Jay was lazy on Dead President II then its fake...
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Of course not, the argument is a fallacy. In the beginning of hip-hop there was always the party emcee and the lyrical emcee. Everything has it's avenue, some markets are more saturated than others; as we see in the mainstream right now. Heads should not put hip-hop into a tidy little box, no other genre of music questions the authenticity of their artist like hip-hop does. I do not enjoy the mainstream in it's current iteration I just don't feel what a lot of these artist talk about, I don't own a $80,000.00 sports car or live the type of lifestyle they claim. It's corny and played out but people seem to enjoy that type of hip-hop and I largely ignore it. To be honest I have never listened to a Rick Ross album and probably never will, I have heard songs by him and the quality is so much beyond garbage that it amazes me that he is such a popular artist as the guys really has no creative merits to add, terrible flow, terrible lyrics and terrible message. I just don't see the appeal in a lot of these artist in the mainstream I guess.
With all that said don't get stuff confused, back in the day if you were wack we called you wack end of story. We did not question whether or not you were making hip-hop or not, the question was did you make quality hip-hop or not, and were your lyrics "real and true" meaning were you authentic in what you depicted. You can't claim to be a drug dealer if your previous career was a C.O. . You cannot be considered one of the greatest if you consistently bite one your peers, but the mainstream has gone beyond this now.
As for the 3 artist you mentioned, I tend to not care, cause after all this is hip-hop, and as an emcee should you not attack another emcee? Been going on for along time, I just let the quality of music form my opinion.
So again I don't believe there is such a thing as real hip-hop, just quality and non quality. Wack and not wack.
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Real Hip Hop is hip hop made without the thirst for commercial success and money
In short it basically means your a real musician who actually knows the history of the craft and are actual artists.
There is a such thing as real hip hop and most of these dudes are not it because they have no respect for their community,craft,or culture.
Only ppl who are not hip hop say there's no such thing as real hip hop.
There is a difference between rap and hip hop and MCs and rappers
rappers don't care about creativity,substance,lyrics they care about what will make them money and what's hot
It's about intent.? that.I know I'm real hip hop -
Of course not, the argument is a fallacy. In the beginning of hip-hop there was always the party emcee and the lyrical emcee. Everything has it's avenue, some markets are more saturated than others; as we see in the mainstream right now. Heads should not put hip-hop into a tidy little box, no other genre of music questions the authenticity of their artist like hip-hop does. I do not enjoy the mainstream in it's current iteration I just don't feel what a lot of these artist talk about, I don't own a $80,000.00 sports car or live the type of lifestyle they claim. It's corny and played out but people seem to enjoy that type of hip-hop and I largely ignore it. To be honest I have never listened to a Rick Ross album and probably never will, I have heard songs by him and the quality is so much beyond garbage that it amazes me that he is such a popular artist as the guys really has no creative merits to add, terrible flow, terrible lyrics and terrible message. I just don't see the appeal in a lot of these artist in the mainstream I guess.
With all that said don't get stuff confused, back in the day if you were wack we called you wack end of story. We did not question whether or not you were making hip-hop or not, the question was did you make quality hip-hop or not, and were your lyrics "real and true" meaning were you authentic in what you depicted. You can't claim to be a drug dealer if your previous career was a C.O. . You cannot be considered one of the greatest if you consistently bite one your peers, but the mainstream has gone beyond this now.
As for the 3 artist you mentioned, I tend to not care, cause after all this is hip-hop, and as an emcee should you not attack another emcee? Been going on for along time, I just let the quality of music form my opinion.
So again I don't believe there is such a thing as real hip-hop, just quality and non quality. Wack and not wack.
Man....COTDAYUM this is a fire post! Very true!!
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Real Hip Hop is hip hop made without the thirst for commercial success and money
In short it basically means your a real musician who actually knows the history of the craft and are actual artists.
There is a such thing as real hip hop and most of these dudes are not it because they have no respect for their community,craft,or culture.
Only ppl who are not hip hop say there's no such thing as real hip hop.
There is a difference between rap and hip hop and MCs and rappers
rappers don't care about creativity,substance,lyrics they care about what will make them money and what's hot
It's about intent.? that.I know I'm real hip hop
Very true, I mean its so stupid why people always make these arguments with no knowledge or background to support it. -
Of course not, the argument is a fallacy. In the beginning of hip-hop there was always the party emcee and the lyrical emcee. Everything has it's avenue, some markets are more saturated than others; as we see in the mainstream right now. Heads should not put hip-hop into a tidy little box, no other genre of music questions the authenticity of their artist like hip-hop does. I do not enjoy the mainstream in it's current iteration I just don't feel what a lot of these artist talk about, I don't own a $80,000.00 sports car or live the type of lifestyle they claim. It's corny and played out but people seem to enjoy that type of hip-hop and I largely ignore it. To be honest I have never listened to a Rick Ross album and probably never will, I have heard songs by him and the quality is so much beyond garbage that it amazes me that he is such a popular artist as the guys really has no creative merits to add, terrible flow, terrible lyrics and terrible message. I just don't see the appeal in a lot of these artist in the mainstream I guess.
With all that said don't get stuff confused, back in the day if you were wack we called you wack end of story. We did not question whether or not you were making hip-hop or not, the question was did you make quality hip-hop or not, and were your lyrics "real and true" meaning were you authentic in what you depicted. You can't claim to be a drug dealer if your previous career was a C.O. . You cannot be considered one of the greatest if you consistently bite one your peers, but the mainstream has gone beyond this now.
As for the 3 artist you mentioned, I tend to not care, cause after all this is hip-hop, and as an emcee should you not attack another emcee? Been going on for along time, I just let the quality of music form my opinion.
So again I don't believe there is such a thing as real hip-hop, just quality and non quality. Wack and not wack.
Metal bands are just as critical of their artists and punk rock is basically the same scene as hip hop but white ppl mostly.
Raggae also is very critical of being true to the culture.They hate pop raggae -
Only ppl who are not hip hop say there's no such thing as real hip hop.
I take exception to that, I mean I am pretty sure I am hip-hop to the core and I don't subscribe to that belief. Again if we are talking hip-hop; beats, rhymes and life then sadly YMCMB and MMG are hip-hop, it is not very good hip-hop but it is what it is. Just b/c we do not agree with the subject matter and image behind the music does not make it hip-hop. Now if you want to talk crossover ? , like the Common song posted above, then understand that is not hip-hop in anyway shape or form, rapper featured or not.
Is Premo any less hip-hop cause he laid tracks for Limp Bizkit and Christina Aguilera? I would say 100% no, would you not agree?
As for metal bands being critical of one and other. Sure they are but you have to understand that the sub genres of Speed Metal, Heavy Metal, Death Metal etc. are widely accepted by each fan base and they will argue just the same over which is more "real". But just like hip-hop it is all still metal regardless of which type. As for the punk rock comment, it is a music based off of anti establishment feelings so when say a Blink 182 crosses over, I would expect that it would upset a bunch folks but to be fair; Blink 182 was not using traditional punk rock when they blew up, they changed there style of music to "sell out". Are we talking Reggae or Dancehall? Cause there is a difference. I have hears rumors that Supercat was not allowed back to Jamaica after coming up to the States and blowing up, is this true? Not sure . Artist like Sean Paul and Nina Sky do not make Reggae or Dancehall music, they make pop music. And to be fair Shabba Ranks, Elephant Man, T.O.K. & Beenie Man have all had massive hits and are still considered Dancehall musicians I mean ? when I was in the islands 2-3 yrs ago, Chaka Demus and Pliers were still getting burn.
What I meant by that comment is, Rock and Country music do not put there artist in a box, nor should hip-hop. And I could have misunderstood what you meant when you posted that comment, I agree that the purist of those genres argue the same as hip-hop heads but my point is we should not as fans of the music. If an artist has an issue with another artist that is on them and he should just enjoy the good music available to us.
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Double post, what is with the cannot delete post feature?
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For the most part, just because they crossover either doesn't mean they are not real hip hop as well. Eminem comes to mind, he started underground and now he's more mainstream now. No matter how people think of him, he's still hip hop.
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For the most part, just because they crossover either doesn't mean they are not real hip hop as well. Eminem comes to mind, he started underground and now he's more mainstream now. No matter how people think of him, he's still hip hop.
Agree 100% there are of ton of rappers that come to mind, I mean lets be real here the song Jay used to blow up big time "Hard Knock Life" is 100% hip-hop no doubt and that goes for a ton of rappers. I am not saying commercial = bad and underground = good, I am saying lets just enjoy the music as there have been plenty of crossover artist that I have still enjoyed once they did. -
some things are authentic... some things are not... so yes there is such a thing as real hip hop...
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dakidfrankie wrote: »there is no "Real Hip Hop"...hip hop is what you think it is...some may think Nas is hip hop while others feel Waka Flocka is
this
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I thought this most recent interview w/ Bumpy Knuckles and DJ Premier would add to this discussion:
http://youtu.be/d3vjo2v-7yc -
I just watched the interview, make sure you check it out! They were really telling it like it is!
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I just watched the interview, make sure you check it out! They were really telling it like it is!
It is a great interview on both their parts, just speaking truth. What Bumpy said about the radio is very true. Premo talking about regions and different styles. Nice find!
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Only ppl who are not hip hop say there's no such thing as real hip hop.
I take exception to that, I mean I am pretty sure I am hip-hop to the core and I don't subscribe to that belief. Again if we are talking hip-hop; beats, rhymes and life then sadly YMCMB and MMG are hip-hop, it is not very good hip-hop but it is what it is. Just b/c we do not agree with the subject matter and image behind the music does not make it hip-hop. Now if you want to talk crossover ? , like the Common song posted above, then understand that is not hip-hop in anyway shape or form, rapper featured or not.
Is Premo any less hip-hop cause he laid tracks for Limp Bizkit and Christina Aguilera? I would say 100% no, would you not agree?
As for metal bands being critical of one and other. Sure they are but you have to understand that the sub genres of Speed Metal, Heavy Metal, Death Metal etc. are widely accepted by each fan base and they will argue just the same over which is more "real". But just like hip-hop it is all still metal regardless of which type. As for the punk rock comment, it is a music based off of anti establishment feelings so when say a Blink 182 crosses over, I would expect that it would upset a bunch folks but to be fair; Blink 182 was not using traditional punk rock when they blew up, they changed there style of music to "sell out". Are we talking Reggae or Dancehall? Cause there is a difference. I have hears rumors that Supercat was not allowed back to Jamaica after coming up to the States and blowing up, is this true? Not sure . Artist like Sean Paul and Nina Sky do not make Reggae or Dancehall music, they make pop music. And to be fair Shabba Ranks, Elephant Man, T.O.K. & Beenie Man have all had massive hits and are still considered Dancehall musicians I mean ? when I was in the islands 2-3 yrs ago, Chaka Demus and Pliers were still getting burn.
What I meant by that comment is, Rock and Country music do not put there artist in a box, nor should hip-hop. And I could have misunderstood what you meant when you posted that comment, I agree that the purist of those genres argue the same as hip-hop heads but my point is we should not as fans of the music. If an artist has an issue with another artist that is on them and he should just enjoy the good music available to us.
I strongly disagree.Like I said it's intent.if your just in it for the bread following trends with no artistry of yourself you are not real hip hop to me.
And a lot of those guys who are wack you may be talking about go out of their way to not be called hip hop like ? C and Waka who basically say ? hip hop
RIP ? but, that ain't hip hop having the attitude of ? hip hop
If you don't respect the craft and the history you are not hip hop to me.Your into rap(not you personally)
That primo interview is the truth -
Only ppl who are not hip hop say there's no such thing as real hip hop.
I take exception to that, I mean I am pretty sure I am hip-hop to the core and I don't subscribe to that belief. Again if we are talking hip-hop; beats, rhymes and life then sadly YMCMB and MMG are hip-hop, it is not very good hip-hop but it is what it is. Just b/c we do not agree with the subject matter and image behind the music does not make it hip-hop. Now if you want to talk crossover ? , like the Common song posted above, then understand that is not hip-hop in anyway shape or form, rapper featured or not.
Is Premo any less hip-hop cause he laid tracks for Limp Bizkit and Christina Aguilera? I would say 100% no, would you not agree?
As for metal bands being critical of one and other. Sure they are but you have to understand that the sub genres of Speed Metal, Heavy Metal, Death Metal etc. are widely accepted by each fan base and they will argue just the same over which is more "real". But just like hip-hop it is all still metal regardless of which type. As for the punk rock comment, it is a music based off of anti establishment feelings so when say a Blink 182 crosses over, I would expect that it would upset a bunch folks but to be fair; Blink 182 was not using traditional punk rock when they blew up, they changed there style of music to "sell out". Are we talking Reggae or Dancehall? Cause there is a difference. I have hears rumors that Supercat was not allowed back to Jamaica after coming up to the States and blowing up, is this true? Not sure . Artist like Sean Paul and Nina Sky do not make Reggae or Dancehall music, they make pop music. And to be fair Shabba Ranks, Elephant Man, T.O.K. & Beenie Man have all had massive hits and are still considered Dancehall musicians I mean ? when I was in the islands 2-3 yrs ago, Chaka Demus and Pliers were still getting burn.
What I meant by that comment is, Rock and Country music do not put there artist in a box, nor should hip-hop. And I could have misunderstood what you meant when you posted that comment, I agree that the purist of those genres argue the same as hip-hop heads but my point is we should not as fans of the music. If an artist has an issue with another artist that is on them and he should just enjoy the good music available to us.
I strongly disagree.Like I said it's intent.if your just in it for the bread following trends with no artistry of yourself you are not real hip hop to me.
And a lot of those guys who are wack you may be talking about go out of their way to not be called hip hop like ? C and Waka who basically say ? hip hop
RIP ? but, that ain't hip hop having the attitude of ? hip hop
If you don't respect the craft and the history you are not hip hop to me.Your into rap(not you personally)
That primo interview is the truth
I see what you mean! Freddie Foxx even said that he loves when the new up and coming artists come to him or others with questions, because they know Bumpy, Preme, and many other legends would know exactly whats going on in the game. When these artists don't show appreciation of the legends in the game saying that "they are past their prime" yet sign their lives away on these record label's contracts, that indicates that they don't have appreciation for the art that they represent and are in it for the money. And Waka Flocka, lol, haha....man you should've never used him as an example. IMO he's the new generation Stepin Fetchit, he don't even talk right in his interviews. Those record labels sure know how to pick them....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrkRbdRhAdE
Oh BTW, that is me on the comments saying "I could see Waka Flocka working at Good Burger!" -
I do agree with you that if you don't respect the craft and history and your intent is strictly for dollars then your more than likely going to fail and make some wack hip-hop music.
