Discovered on a faded scrap of papyrus, the words "Jesus said to them, 'My wife …'"

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  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2012
    Forget just the mormons...u wanna kno what plague awaits anyone who dies without Christ? Hell.

    Ehh. I'm giving you an example of a group that has added to the Bible and have not yet received any "plagues" as far as I know. The Bible says that if anyone adds to the "prophecies" of this "scroll" or "book", which can be taken as the Book of Revelations (specifically the prophecy) and not the entire Bible. The writer(s) of Revelations did not know that a book of Christian literature would be put together and called "the Bible" so I doubt that the writer(s) meant that additions to "The Bible" would garner punishment. Either way, I don't believe it. Threatening a non theist with hell does not have any effect. A person would have to believe in hell to be scared of it.


    and ur other claims about missing books and what not..come on bro. there is absolutely NO credible evidence to support ur claim.

    http://gbgm-umc.org/umw/bible/outside.stm

    http://www.icwseminary.org/lostbooks.htm

    Dev. of Old Test. >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_of_the_Old_Testament_canon
    Dev. of New Test. >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_of_the_New_Testament_canon


    Or what about the book of Enoch? Is that in your copy of the Bible?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Enoch
    and no one recorded him to say the same thing? whos him? Jesus?. Bro, do you selectively read? cuz it seems like u do. if i quote a Jay lyric, just a few bars, and someone else quoted another set of bars from the same song, and say YOU quoted the end of the song. is it right for someone who thinks like you to say Jay did not say those lyrics cuz all of our accounts werent the same? i thought so.

    I'm pretty sure if someone very important today were to be killed, eye witnesses would be able to quote his last words and they would all agree as to what he/she said before he/she "gave up the ghost".

    Luke wasn't even an eye witness:
    Luke wrote: »
    1 Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled[a] among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught.

    And to add onto what I said earlier (that we have enough evidence to suggest that Matthew copied from Mark), why did Matthew get his information from Mark if he was an eye witness to the events he describes?

    Mark was not an eye witness either. He received his information from Peter.

    No one knows who wrote these books. The authors were originally anonymous.
  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2012
    you would have to refute what i said about the ORIGINAL MANUSCRIPTS WHICH ARE STILL HERE TODAY, to even THINK about claiming such idiotic tales about mis-translations and additions.

    Textual scholar Bart Ehrman writes: "It is true, of course, that the New Testament is abundantly attested in the manuscripts produced through the ages, but most of these manuscripts are many centuries removed from the originals, and none of them perfectly accurate. They all contain mistakes - altogether many thousands of mistakes. It is not an easy task to reconstruct the original words of the New Testament...."[2]

    Every year, several New Testament manuscripts handwritten in the original Greek format are discovered. The latest substantial find was in 2008, when 47 new manuscripts were discovered in Albania; at least 17 of them unknown to Western scholars.[5] When comparing one manuscript to another, with the exception of the smallest fragments, no two copies agree completely throughout. There has been an estimate of 400,000 variations among all these manuscripts (from the 2nd to 15th century) which is more than there are words in the New Testament. This is less significant than may appear since it is a comparison across linguistic boundaries. More important estimates focus on comparing texts within languages. Those variations are considerably fewer. The vast majority of these are accidental errors made by scribes, and are easily identified as such: an omitted word, a duplicate line, a misspelling, a rearrangement of words. Some variations involve apparently intentional changes, which often make more difficult a determination of whether they were corrections from better exemplars, harmonizations between readings, or ideologically motivated.[6] Palaeography is the study of ancient writing, and textual criticism is the study of manuscripts in order to reconstruct a probable original text.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_manuscript
    the fact that u said Paul created Christianity lmaoooo. do u even kno Paul's story? i doubt u do.

    Jesus preached Judaism. Christianity did not come until after Jesus' death; Paul preached "Christianity", a faith based on the life and teachings of Jesus "the Christ". Jesus never once mentioned "Christianity". Paul had never met Jesus, btw. You can read more about that here: http://www.sullivan-county.com/news/paul/paul.htm
  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    alissowack wrote: »
    @west_brooklyn. Just because someone has a right to their beliefs doesn't mean they are "right" in what they believe...or that they have a respect for what they believe. The problem with people in religion sometimes is that they really don't respect what it is they are believing. They are just using religion for their own selfish motives. It is good to question people about what they believe, but it helps to get a better understanding on what it is they are believing and why they believe it...and not just going to trusted sites or authors or pick on those you know are "vulnerable". Go into enemy territory from time to time and at least see if there are respectable people out there that do represent what they believe well. There in people in my life I don't particularly agree with, but they command my respect.

    I see where you are coming from. Very well. I will continue the debate
  • supaman4321
    supaman4321 Members Posts: 946
    edited September 2012
    matt- wrote: »
    It's pretty interesting. Jesus never referred to himself as being ? or the unique son of ? or ? in the flesh. Other people promoted that mostly, most notably Paul, who didn't even actually know Jesus. And the only Gospel that really goes out of it's way to portray Jesus as divine was John, and that particular book was the last of the Gospels written and was clearly in response to the debate over whether Jesus was divine or not.

    do you even know what you are talking about?

    John 10


    30 I and the Father are one.”

    32 but Jesus said to them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?”

    33 “We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be ? .”

    34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[d]? 35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of ? came—and Scripture cannot be set aside— 36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am ? ’s Son’? 37 Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. 38 But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”

    How can they be one in the same when the VERY LINE BEFORE THAT he says my Father is Greater than all, he is of course included in that all so why are you trying to make this man out to be schizophrenic?

    29 "My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand."

    he never called himself ? or the exclusive son of ? like the brother said; do YOU know what you're talking about?
  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2012
  • Melqart
    Melqart Guests, Members Posts: 3,679 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Look, ill drop some knowledge here for yall. couldnt care less whether you believe me or not, but the ones with the eyes to see and the heart & karma to find the truth will with dedication.

    Yes. Yeshua was definitely married to magdalene. yes Yeshua was one with ? . but we are all gods, just isolated by our earthly desires & karma. That is the whole point of his story. Yeshua was originally an example of what any one of us could become by pursuing the mysteries of life with a pure heart & correct guidance. by this i mean. the things that Yeshua could do, are in no way unique or special when compared to others along their own paths of cultivation. Also. he was never crucified, sorry to say. & Yes the Bible has been greatly edited numerous of times, for the agendas of the Elder oligarchies who could easily use such an influential doctrine to gain more control. this is why they use the "Original sin" & "jesus died for our sins" as a psychological fear & guilt inducing control mechanism. not to say the the bible doesnt have its inner allegories still embedded for those with the eyes to see, just its meanings in the most exoteric sense have been altered.
  • Bodhi
    Bodhi Members Posts: 7,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If that's not enough for you, @Jack_Riches, I would like for you to explain the contradiction between the dates of the crucifixion in relation to the Passover in Mark 14-16 and John 13-19.

    Specifically, Mark 15:25 says:
    Mark 15:25 wrote: »
    It was nine in the morning when they crucified him

    But John 19:14 says:
    John 19:14 wrote: »
    it was about noon.



    Mark says that Jesus was executed
    Mark 14:12 wrote: »
    On the first day of the Festival of Unleavened Bread, when it was customary to sacrifice the Passover lamb

    Keep in mind that the FOUB begins the day AFTER passover
    The Lord’s Passover begins at twilight on the fourteenth day of the first month. On the fifteenth day of that month the Lord’s Festival of Unleavened Bread begins; for seven days you must eat bread made without yeast.

    John says that Jesus was executed on
    John 19:14 wrote: »
    the day of Preparation of the Passover
    John 13:1 wrote: »
    just before the Passover Festival

  • (Nope)
    (Nope) Members Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭✭✭
    it was written many things will be said about Christ after his death to disapprove the truth. its all about what we choose to believe. His Father believed that man should marry woman in holy matrimony so im sure he considered it while he was alive but Jesus was no ordinary man. He came to earth to take care of His Fathers business not to get married to a woman, at least thats my point of view until real actual evidence proves me wrong

    What was written about transvestites ?