I never understood the support for Mumia Abu Jamal

Knives Amilli
Knives Amilli Members Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited May 2013 in The Social Lounge
At all.

this quote from a OWS site sums up my stance far better than I ever could:


"Here's the thing y'all. Yes, the criminal justice system is brutally unfair. It is racist. It is classist. It is broken beyond all repair. The prison industrial complex has swallowed any hopes that a poor black man ever had to a right to a fair trial in this country. HOWEVER, Mumia? Mumia is guilty as hell. Guilty, guilty, guilty. He stood over Officer Daniel Faulkner with a gun registered in his own name and shot him point blank in the face in front of multiple witnesses.

Because of Mumia's involvement with The Black Panthers, because of his background as a guerilla journalist, and because of the undoubtedly racist climate of Frank Rizzo's police department in the 1980's, Mumia's conviction became a cause celebre......."


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  • Meta_Conscious
    Meta_Conscious Members Posts: 26,227 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Eyewitnesses huh... well he must b guilty then...lol
  • konceptjones
    konceptjones Guests, Members, Writer, Content Producer Posts: 13,139 ✭✭✭✭✭
    there were also "eyewitnesses" at trial for Ruben "The Hurricane" Carter's conviction.
  • Knives Amilli
    Knives Amilli Members Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Stopitfive wrote: »
    Eyewitnesses huh... well he must b guilty then...lol

    yeah i guess having a shoulder holster, a warm gun and 5 casings matching the caliber of the pistol (registered in Jamals name) arent solid evidence.
  • 7figz
    7figz Members Posts: 15,294 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • Knives Amilli
    Knives Amilli Members Posts: 4,632 ✭✭✭✭✭
    7figz wrote: »
    smh.gif

    Now i know your anti cop as it is, but that aside. what pertinent facts supports Mumia's innocence?
  • Maximus Rex
    Maximus Rex Members Posts: 6,354 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2013
    I don't know details of the case, but Mumia is one of "support-the-? -at-all-costs-even-at-expense-of-black-people's integrity."

    The thing about Abu Jamal in addition to what Knives Amilli said, after being shot by Officer Faulkner, Abu Jamal said,“I shot the ? , and I hope he dies.

    Read more at http://themoderatevoice.com/9339/mumia-abu-jamal-still-guilty-after-all-these-years/#JQ4JpuEximTLe2XL.99


    [img]http://sphotos-a.? .fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/p480x480/428373_10150732601476159_1978850300_n.jpg[/img]

    2057139.jpg

    The ^^^^^ are a movie and documentary on the subject.
  • 7figz
    7figz Members Posts: 15,294 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2013
    7figz wrote: »
    smh.gif

    Now i know your anti cop as it is, but that aside. what pertinent facts supports Mumia's innocence?

    I'm anti - [anybody tryin' to ? me] or anybody that's anti-me.

    Do a cursory review of freemumia.com.
  • edwardnigma
    edwardnigma Members Posts: 3,364 ✭✭✭✭✭
    No matter his case hes like or simialar to Charles Manson

    Its the messaged he conveys, I was into it as a teen

    Im into my own.ideas now but yeah Its about the messages he was putting out

    People like lets say Dead Prez found themselves inspired or influenced
  • A1000MILES
    A1000MILES Members, Writer Posts: 13,287 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Free Boosie...
  • Black Boy King
    Black Boy King Members Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Stopped at "the judicial system is brutally unfair." Thats all that needs to be said.

    And lay witnesses loses credibility the more they talk to cops, prosecutors, etc due to coaching.
  • Black Boy King
    Black Boy King Members Posts: 6,984 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Stopitfive wrote: »
    Eyewitnesses huh... well he must b guilty then...lol

    yeah i guess having a shoulder holster, a warm gun and 5 casings matching the caliber of the pistol (registered in Jamals name) arent solid evidence.

    You do know if a cop is assaulting someone, it is your right (duty maybe?) for you to fend off said agressor..?
  • Ounceman
    Ounceman Members Posts: 6,702 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2013
    The fact that he shot a cop at point black range, and uttered the cold and calculated statements afterwards warrants my respect even more
  • Swiffness!
    Swiffness! Members Posts: 10,128 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ? the eyewitnesses, the forensics bury ? . Ballistics? Gunpowder residue? Gun in HIS NAME lol?

    and what kills me is everyone act like Danny Faulk wasn't whippin Mumia brother's ass with a flashlight when he showed up......that's motive like a muhfucka. ? that, my position always been that Faulkner was a racist-ass cop who's chickens came home to roost that day. “I shot the ? , and I hope he dies.”? You damn right he shot that ? that was brutally beating his flesh & blood. If it wasn't for that ? -ass cracka's badge Mumia woulda already served his like 12 years for Manslaughter n been released...but you know how that go.

    http://field-? .blogspot.com/ makes most pro-black brothers look like tap dancing ? in comparison, but he's also a defense attorney in Philly and he's said countless times that from where he sit w/ his knowledge & experience, Mumia guilty as hell

    btw ? Faulkner family, i'm beyond tired of hearing these ? victim families that ? and whine like its the biggest injustice in the world just because somebody got LIFE IN PRISON instead of lethal injection. I ? hate this ? . Like it's only justice if someone dies. Like lynchings, and Old English public executions, and vigilante Wild West "justice" were somehow superior. Like we'd really be better off w/ Judge Dredd in this ? . Like only BLOOD will atone.....and it'll always be some Christian white ppl too. You worshipping a man who forgave his executioners and told ppl to turn the other cheek, but as soon as someone hurt YOU, you ready to go all Charles Bronson/Max Payne on ? . They wanna talk that Eye-for-an-Eye ? right up until you mention some of White America's crimes....
    I don't know details of the case, but Mumia is one of "support-the-? -at-all-costs-even-at-expense-of-black-people's integrity."

    real talk this is why i thank ? that O.J was found innocent.

    Could you imagine that ? ? "Free O.J" woulda been the biggest battle cry, you woulda heard that in every rap record from DMX to Dead Prez to MF Doom, you woulda seen it on posters at every rally ever. We'd be petitioning every President to pardon dude, making movies about how he was framed that made it seem like Mississippi Burning, the ? works. Black America dodged a self-inflicted bullet when O.J was acquitted. "FREE OJ". *shudders*
  • Allah_U_Akbar
    Allah_U_Akbar Members Posts: 11,150 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Threadstarter, you answered your own question:



    this quote from a OWS site sums up my stance far better than I ever could:


    " He stood over Officer Daniel Faulkner with a gun registered in his own name and shot him point blank in the face in front of multiple witnesses. "



    ^^^He gets my undying support for THIS "fact" alone.^^^

  • jono
    jono Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1. There was never a paraffin test (for gunpowder residue) on Mumia, prosecution never presented one, so the ballistics are shaky already.

    2. Mumia also doesn't strike me as a total ? idiot, he's a little nutty but not his not stupid. I say that to say this: why would he go cop hunting with his OWN damn GUN?

    3. He was charged with 1st degree murder, which means "premeditated" or that he killed someone while committing another felony (like burglary, robbery, etc). There were other charges on Mumia's docket (possession of an instrument of crime & possession of an instrument of crime concealed), but I'm not exactly sure how the hell those are felonies when he legally possessed a weapon.

    4. "According to trial testimony, Abu-Jamal saw his brother scuffle with the 25-year-old patrolman during a 4 a.m. traffic stop in 1981 and ran toward the scene. Police found Abu-Jamal wounded by a round from Faulkner’s gun. Faulkner, shot several times, was killed. A .38-caliber revolver registered to Abu-Jamal was found at the scene with five spent shell casings."http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2011/10/11/court-turns-down-philadelphi-da-in-mumia-abu-jamal-case/

    Allow me to add that the witness who said he saw the whole thing (Michael Scanlon) admitted on the stand that he couldn't identify anybody.


    Sounds like self-defense could have been an option but I read a bit of the trial transcripts and Mumia didn't really participate in his own defense because he demanded a different lawyer (John Africa; yeah that's the "nutty" I was talking about) and he didn't trust the lawyer he was assigned.

    5. This whole thing about "I shot the ? , and I hope he dies" was never uttered by a witness in court. The man who supposedly heard this never testified...and he's a police officer to boot.


    Its amazing so much misinformation still exists when every trial he's had is online for people to view for themselves. I take it that ? stay on some "didn't read" ? .

    Here's the trial:
    http://www.justice4danielfaulkner.com/frames.html

    Its even on a pro-daniel faulkner website, there is really no secrets in this case.

    Whether you believe he did it or not is always up for debate but at least check out the trial.
  • janklow
    janklow Members, Moderators Posts: 8,613 Regulator
    you know, having read about this case for years, i might have come to the conclusion that everyone involved kind of sucks to some extent
  • jono
    jono Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    **excuse my reference about "1st degree" murder, he was charged with murder, involuntary manslaughter et. al.

    I don't penn law either so perhaps its different there he might not have to be charged w/ 1st degree murder to get the death penalty.

    **also read Michael Scanlon's testimony. Its the testimony that pretty much tells you what happened but he never sees the officer shoot and Mumia was shot. So either Mumia shot himself or the person "Mumia" saved shot him (I put it in quotations because it has to be assumed that he was the one who came running from the parking lot but it wasn't proven).
  • Soloman_The_Wise
    Soloman_The_Wise Members Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭✭✭
    From everything I read it is a ? situation He should have got the Manslaughter charge and by all means would have at the worst if he was not a Anti Government Angry Black Man. A large amount of corruption racism and double standards were used in the case and were common place especially given the time frame as there was not somebody with a camera to catch up the cops around every corner. The outrage I feel is more so he was defending himself and family from police brutality and was charged and convicted as if he was the aggressor instead of the rightgeous defender as he was in this situation same issue most of us have with how they Keep doing Assata but that is more talk for a different thread...
  • KLICHE
    KLICHE Members Posts: 5,061 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2013
    On freemumia.com it states:

    "an affidavit by a court stenographer that Judge Sabo said in a court anteroom about his role in the case, “Yeah, and I’m going to help them fry the ? ”

    "Those who know Mumia – his personal history, character, beliefs, principles, career development and convictions – argue that it is inconceivable that Mumia could be guilty of the cold-blooded murder of Officer Faulkner."

    "During and after the time of Mumia’s arrest, trial, and conviction, police were often convicted of corrupt procedures and of fabricating the guilt of defendants. This makes it considerably more plausible that Mumia, too, was “framed,” especially since he had for so long been routinely singled out by police and authorities for his reporting on police violence in Philadelphia. It is well known, for example, that in 1981, police and prosecutors framed four men: two were acquitted in trials, one in 1982, and the second after spending 1,375 days on death row; the other two men spent nearly 20 years in prison for murder before released on DNA evidence and confessions by the real killers."

  • janklow
    janklow Members, Moderators Posts: 8,613 Regulator
    KLICHE wrote: »
    "Those who know Mumia – his personal history, character, beliefs, principles, career development and convictions – argue that it is inconceivable that Mumia could be guilty of the cold-blooded murder of Officer Faulkner."
    thing is, in ANY case --not just Mumia's-- this kind of statement is not a real argument for innocence. it could be 100% true, but it's still your friends and family saying "we don't think the guy we know and love did it."

  • KLICHE
    KLICHE Members Posts: 5,061 ✭✭✭✭✭
    janklow wrote: »
    KLICHE wrote: »
    "Those who know Mumia – his personal history, character, beliefs, principles, career development and convictions – argue that it is inconceivable that Mumia could be guilty of the cold-blooded murder of Officer Faulkner."
    thing is, in ANY case --not just Mumia's-- this kind of statement is not a real argument for innocence. it could be 100% true, but it's still your friends and family saying "we don't think the guy we know and love did it."

    No definitely not. I might add that that quote in particular had me laughing for that very reason. There have been only a case here and there where I have indeed heard a relative or friend say they were aware that someone was the criminal in the hearing.
  • 2stepz_ahead
    2stepz_ahead Guests, Members, Writer, Content Producer Posts: 32,324 ✭✭✭✭✭
    janklow wrote: »
    you know, having read about this case for years, i might have come to the conclusion that everyone involved kind of sucks to some extent

    ole on the fence justice for all ass ? ...lol
  • janklow
    janklow Members, Moderators Posts: 8,613 Regulator
    pralims wrote: »
    janklow wrote: »
    you know, having read about this case for years, i might have come to the conclusion that everyone involved kind of sucks to some extent
    ole on the fence justice for all ass ? ...lol
    what do you want me to say, man, it's been decades of back-and-forth rhetoric

  • aladdin1978
    aladdin1978 Members Posts: 4,609 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Remember krs and channel live made a song called "free Mumia"? So if krs says it and believes it...it must be a worthy cause