Victor Cruz vs Desean Jackson

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  • O.G.
    O.G. Members Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Coop the d.a. is at it again.
    JXVLg.jpg
  • nujerz84
    nujerz84 Members Posts: 15,418 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2014
    Victor Cruz
    coop9889 wrote: »
    Words of a defeated man scrambling. In a debate choose your words carefully. Big difference between never and rarely. And 1/5 of the time isn't never.

    Again with the nitpicking to fit your viewpoint he still rarely used in the slot and he used less than 1/5 of the time in the slot. I wasnt the one who out of 4 videos that showed 6 TD catches used 1 TD and totally dismissed the other 5 yep that is nitpicking.

    coop9889 wrote: »

    Awww man. This just makes you look stupid. Receptions last year: Desean - 82 Cruz - 73. You better fact check before you ether yourself.

    Season just ended Sunday.. again with the nitpicking you and any one with half a brain know when referring to Last Season its the 2012 season.
    coop9889 wrote: »
    So that means out of the last 3 years Jackson's YAC was better in 2, Cruz's was better in 1.
    Advantage: Desean.


    You were on a roll until you just started spewing out nonsense.

    I'm sure we agree a catch of 20+ yards is a "big play", no?

    (Try to keep up with me. I know your math skills are elementary. I'll explain as best I can)

    2013
    Desean was second in the league in receptions of 20+ yards with 25. (82 catches-126targets)
    Cruz had 10. (73-123)
    (Cruz played 2 less games)

    2012
    Cruz had 12 plays of 20+ yards (on 86 catches & 143 targets) to Desean's 9 (on 45 receptions on 85 targets).
    (Jackson played 5 less games)

    2011
    Cruz had 25 20+ plays (82-131) to Desean's 15. (58-104)
    (Jackson played 1 less game)

    I'm not going to even count 2008-2010 where Desean was 3rd, 8th and 9th in the league in 20+ yard catches.

    Total those up and in the last three years you have:
    Desean with 49 catches of 20+ yards from 185 catches on 315 targets. Do the math and 26% of Desean's catches have gone for 20+ yards.
    Cruz had 47 catches of 20+ yards from 241 catches on 397 targets. 19.5% of his catches were for 20 yards or more.

    Yet again, advantage: Desean.

    As far as the first downs, Cruz has led his team in first downs and targets every year except once, and that one year he had only a few less than Bradshaw. Cruz is easily the biggest threat on the team, Eli's favorite target, and the Giants consistently had some of the worst running games over the past few years.

    On the other side, McCoy was the first down leader consistently and it wasn't even close. McCoy LED THE LEAGUE in first downs 2 of the last 3 years and the year he didn't he was injured. McCoy > BOTH of these receivers, and Eli targets Cruz WAY more than w/e Eagles QB targets Jackson. On 3rd down Giants throw to Cruz all day. Eagles look to McCoy.

    1. I already stated Jackson numbers this season was better. 2. Cruz numbers in the big Play Categories are better than Jackson for 2011 and 2012 season. 3. You stated that Most of Cruz big plays were simply him using his speed on deep passes... So based on the numbers depending how you use and want to see it, numbers go against and also support of what you stated. His big plays and yac are less than Jackson in totality of the last three seasons, but if you judge off the 2011-2012 season, Cruz is greater in big plays.

    Eli Targets Cruz more because perhaps he gets open more and more likely to make the catch.. using the numbers Cruz has a 60% Reception rate compared to Jackson 57% reception rate over that span.

    Advantage: Cruz


    Like YAC, receptions for first down numbers will be weighed down if one has more receptions than the other.

    If you going to give Jackson 2-1 edge in YAC... Then Cruz gets the same edge in plays of over 20 yards or more as he was Better than Jackson in 2011 and 2012.

    Advantage: Cruz

    coop9889 wrote: »
    During this entire post of ? on you I've been handicapping myself by only referring to Desean's last 3 years. Two of which were his worst statistically. Put Desean's best year up he accounted for 12 touchdowns and 1734 yards. Which is better than any of Cruz's seasons. And Jackson did it in 15 games.

    That fact you even have to incorporate Rushing and Returning yards makes my case...As a WR Jackson Numbers are inferior to Cruz. The Numbers Cruz put up since he entered the league in 2010 have been better than Jackson's nearly across the board. That 3 seasons worth for Cruz vs 4 for Jackson.



    coop9889 wrote: »
    Never did I ever claim Desean to NOT be injury prone, yet here you are debating as if I said that. I knew you would. I was simply countering your statement of "Cruz isn't injury prone". He's missed a sizable amount of games.

    Again dismissing the facts around said injuries to suit your viewpoint he could have finished and played out both seasons, The Giants Shut Him Down often times its not the player decision . Team is 5-9 they shut him down... Pulled a Hamstring in Practice as an Undrafted Free Agent Rookie...He was placed on IR so that they could keep him on the roster for next season instead of having to release him ...It was suspicious that even the NFL investigated the cause of the injury and why he was Placed on IR for a minor injury..it worked Giants won the Superbowl the next season Cruz major part of that.



    coop9889 wrote: »
    ? you serious?

    You're flat out WRONG, AGAIN.

    2011-2012
    Cruz: 168 catches 2628 yards 19 TD
    Calvin: 218 catches 3645 yards 21 TD
    Welker: 240 catches 2923 yards 15 TD
    Marshall: 199 catches 2722 yards 17 TD

    Hell Gronk had 28 TDs.

    These are just a few of the ? that BEASTED Cruz during that span. I got tired of adding ? up but there's more.

    ? JASON WITTEN had more catches than Cruz in that span.
    DEZ BRYANT had more TDs. Even a "stupid cowboys fan" can tell you that.

    And lol @ using stats "heading into the 2013 season" as if the 2013 isn't over and done with. Trying to conveniently hide Cruz's worst statistical season, eh?



    That's fine...were does Desean Jackson rate in those rankings........I'll wait.. Just like you brought up Jackson last two seasons being his worst. Even Cruz worst season 2013 is on par with Desean Jackson Career Season Averages.

    Missing 2 Full Games and 2nd Half of another

    Cruz 2013 Season 73 Catches 998 Yards 4 Td's
    Jackson Season Averages per season for his career 59 Catches 1019 yards 5 Td's

    Yet even with Cruz worst season this season his numbers have been better and that's with Jackson arguably having his best season as wide out this year.

    Since Cruz entered the NFL he been a Better WR period.

    I'm not the one who posted a Preseason game as evidence. Nor am I the one who claims a perennial contender who won the Super Bowl as a Fluke Champion... Get Ya Lame self out the the NFL discussion. You dont want it B.

    Since Cruz entered the NFL he been a Better WR period.


  • coop9889
    coop9889 Members Posts: 7,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2014
    Desean Jackson
    AHAHAHAHA I'm wasting my time here but got nothing better to do at work than continuously destroy this ? .

    Seriously, you are arguing with emotion. I'm arguing with logic. Learn the difference and if your next post doesn't improve we are done.

    And lol @ this ? copying my style with the "try again" and the "advantage:___". You're my son.
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Again with the nitpicking to fit your viewpoint he still rarely used in the slot and he used less than 1/5 of the time in the slot. I wasnt the one who out of 4 videos that showed 6 TD catches used 1 TD and totally dismissed the other 5 yep that is nitpicking.

    Simple logic:

    1) You said Jackson NEVER lines up in the slot.
    2) I proved he lines up in the slot almost 1/5 of the time.

    Now I'm 'nitpicking'. End this point. You lost this one.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Season just ended Sunday.. again with the nitpicking you and any one with half a brain know when referring to Last Season its the 2012 season.

    The Giants and Eagles seasons ended before that. And even still, "last season" still refers to 2013-2014. Like I said lil ? , choose your words carefully.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    1. I already stated Jackson numbers this season was better. 2. Cruz numbers in the big Play Categories are better than Jackson for 2011 and 2012 season.

    So when you COMBINE these two points, who comes out on top in big plays? Desean. I already explained this. Lol why the ? would you separate 2011-2012 from the season that just ended?

    You're horrible at this.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    His big plays and yac are less than Jackson in totality of the last three seasons, but if you judge off the 2011-2012 season, Cruz is greater.

    LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    "You're totally right but if we narrow it down to specifically cruz's best seasons then IM RIGHT!"

    Pitiful.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Eli Targets Cruz more because perhaps he gets open more and more likely to make the catch.. using the numbers Cruz has a 60% Reception rate compared to Jackson 57% reception rate over that span.

    It's really 59% to Cruz's 61%. Negligible difference but sure if it makes you happy. Nearly everybody in the thread agrees Cruz has better hands, but only catching 2% more throws? Not very compelling..

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    If you going to give Jackson 2-1 edge in YAC... Then Cruz gets the same edge in plays of over 20 yards or more as he was Better than Jackson in 2011 and 2012.

    Lol in 2012 he played in FIVE more games than Desean and had only THREE more plays of 20+ more yards. The statistic I used in my argument was an AVERAGE, to fairly compare yards after catch between the two. You are comparing TOTALS which DEFINITELY is skewed in Cruz's favor seeing as he played in way more games than Desean.

    Once again, ? poor logic.

    Come at me with the average number of 20+yard plays per game each of them had and try again.
    (Hint- Advantage: Desean)

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    That fact you even have to incorporate Rushing and Returning yards makes my case.

    Oh? Realllllly? Does it?

    I seem to remember my original case was:
    coop9889 wrote: »
    As a receiver it's a coin toss honestly. But overall impact as a player, it's Desean hands down like greenwood said.
    coop9889 wrote: »
    Point is the gap between the two receiver's skill is small and can be argued in either direction. Jackson's impact on special teams overrides that gap.

    I've already stated that one can argue for EITHER receiver in terms of solely being a receiver. And I've already dissected your ? ass argument into pieces based off points YOU initiated.

    You said Cruz's YAC was better, I disproved it.
    You said Cruz is a bigger deep threat/makes more big plays, I disproved it.

    And I did it using 2 of Jackson's worst years statistically.

    The reason I can't take you seriously is you're so caught up in emotion and the fact that I'm completely owning you that you've lost sight of my original argument. IMPACT AS AN OVERALL PLAYER.

    The fact that you scoff at me including special teams numbers proves it.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Again dismissing the facts around said injuries to suit your viewpoint he could have finished and played out both seasons, The Giants Shut Him Down often times its not the player decision . Team is 5-9 they shut him down... Pulled a Hamstring in Practice as an Undrafted Free Agent Rookie...He was placed on IR so that they could keep him on the roster for next season instead of having to release him ...It was suspicious that even the NFL investigated the cause of the injury and why he was Placed on IR for a minor injury..it worked Giants won the Superbowl the next season Cruz major part of that.

    All of this to say Victor Cruz isn't injury prone, wow. This "investigation" you keep blabbing about was the NFL sending him to an independent doctor who CONFIRMED what the Giant's doctors were saying about the injury. Nothing more. This injury prone point is boring, and I feel sorry for you. I'll let you have "Desean is more injury prone than Cruz"

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    That's fine...were does Desean Jackson rate in those rankings........I'll wait..

    LMAO this ? says Cruz led the league in every important receiving category from 2011-2012 and got completely exposed on his lack of knowledge.

    His response is "That's fine".

    LMAOOOOO

    Then you try to turn it around on Jackson. I ain't falling for that. I never said he led in anything. I actually make sure I'm right before making ridiculous claims. You should try it.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Just like you brought up Jackson last two seasons being his worst. Even Cruz worst season 2013 is on par with Desean Jackson Career Season Averages.

    Missing 2 Full Games and 2nd Half of another

    Cruz 2013 Season 73 Catches 998 Yards 4 Td's
    Jackson Season Averages per season for his career 59 Catches 1019 yards 5 Td's

    So with 14 less catches, Desean still getting more yards and Td's.

    Good job proving NOTHING in your favor.

    I mean... you gotta be trolling. Jesus Christ.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    I'm not the one who posted a Preseason game as evidence. Nor am I the one who claims a perennial contender who won the Super Bowl as a Fluke Champion... Get Ya Lame self out the the NFL discussion. You dont want it B.

    Ahhh the common tactic of a loser. Desperate times call for desperate measures, eh? Please explain to me the relevance of this statement in this debate?




    This is mindblowing. Lame ? like Blu and woat316 put up a better fight. Who is this no name ? ???????
  • A$AP_A$TON
    A$AP_A$TON Members Posts: 11,691 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    A.J. Green>>>all them ?

    #YeaImBias #SoWhat
  • Heavy In The Game
    Heavy In The Game Members Posts: 3,911 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    A$AP_A$TON wrote: »
    A.J. Green>>>all them ?

    #YeaImBias #SoWhat

    there's no bias he is better
  • nujerz84
    nujerz84 Members Posts: 15,418 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2014
    Victor Cruz
    coop9889 wrote: »
    Simple logic:

    1) You said Jackson NEVER lines up in the slot.
    2) I proved he lines up in the slot almost 1/5 of the time.

    Now I'm 'nitpicking'. End this point. You lost this one.

    You been nitpicking from the jump...this a internet forum, perhaps you should look up hyperbole/semantics and understand its meaning. He used 18% of time he still hardly used in the slot he lines up majority on the outside.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    The Giants and Eagles seasons ended before that. And even still, "last season" still refers to 2013-2014. Like I said lil ? , choose your words carefully.

    Again this is nitpicking and arguing lexical semantics just like with the not lining up in the Slot debate... last season is the 2012-2013 season. Try again.


    coop9889 wrote: »
    So when you COMBINE these two points, who comes out on top in big plays? Desean. I already explained this. Lol why the ? would you separate 2011-2012 from the season that just ended?

    You're horrible at this.

    Why would you weigh one great season and not factor 2 avg seasons?
    Cruz just had his worst season of his short 3 year career. In two of his three seasons Cruz was better in the Big Play Categories...bottom line why would you dismiss that over Jackson 1 great year. It shows Cruz consistency in his performance as a Wide Out.

    In essence you're arguing in 2011 and 2012 Desean Jackson was a better WR than Victor Cruz even the biggest Philly fan would say that not true.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    "You're totally right but if we narrow it down to specifically cruz's best seasons then IM RIGHT!"

    Pitiful.

    Not as pitiful as weighing one great season over two great seasons which is you're doing.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    It's really 59% to Cruz's 61%. Negligible difference but sure if it makes you happy. Nearly everybody in the thread agrees Cruz has better hands, but only catching 2% more throws? Not very compelling..

    Still in favor of Cruz.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    Lol in 2012 he played in FIVE more games than Desean and had only THREE more plays of 20+ more yards. The statistic I used in my argument was an AVERAGE, to fairly compare yards after catch between the two. You are comparing TOTALS which DEFINITELY is skewed in Cruz's favor seeing as he played in way more games than Desean.

    Once again, ? poor logic.

    Come at me with the average number of 20+yard plays per game each of them had and try again.
    (Hint- Advantage: Desean)

    Just like YAC are skewed towards amount of receptions per game we can go back and forth. If you want to use averages or totals... Cruz totals was greater.
    coop9889 wrote: »
    Oh? Realllllly? Does it?

    I seem to remember my original case was:


    I've already stated that one can argue for EITHER receiver in terms of solely being a receiver. And I've already dissected your ? ass argument into pieces based off points YOU initiated.

    You said Cruz's YAC was better, I disproved it.
    You said Cruz is a bigger deep threat/makes more big plays, I disproved it.

    And I did it using 2 of Jackson's worst years statistically.

    The reason I can't take you seriously is you're so caught up in emotion and the fact that I'm completely owning you that you've lost sight of my original argument. IMPACT AS AN OVERALL PLAYER.

    My original argument from the jump was overall was that Cruz is a better WR than Jackson and he has been since he entered the NFL .





    coop9889 wrote: »
    LMAO this ? says Cruz led the league in every important receiving category from 2011-2012 and got completely exposed on his lack of knowledge.

    His response is "That's fine".

    LMAOOOOO

    Then you try to turn it around on Jackson. I ain't falling for that. I never said he led in anything. I actually make sure I'm right before making ridiculous claims. You should try it.

    I concede this point.


    coop9889 wrote: »
    So with 14 less catches, Desean still getting more yards and Td's.

    Good job proving NOTHING in your favor.

    I mean... you gotta be trolling. Jesus Christ.

    You can't be serious. In Cruz worse season in which he missed 2.5 games his production on the field was nearly identical to what Jackson Averages as Wide Receiver per season in his entire career. But now this about totals and not averages (Big Play Statistics) so whose the one trolling and changing arguments ?

    coop9889 wrote: »
    Ahhh the common tactic of a loser. Desperate times call for desperate measures, eh? Please explain to me the relevance of this statement in this debate?

    Its factual statements. I posted up 4 videos that disproved that Cruz just runs Fast and catches a deep ball. You posted up 2 videos one of which was a preseason game (not even the 3rd Preseason Game at That) to make your point which is stupidity at its finest. I called you out on the idiocy of doing so, your next post you start bringing up charts and numbers.

    Me bringing up your statement regarding Baltimore Ravens shows you have been known to say ? ? . Its all relevant.
  • shieky
    shieky Members Posts: 1,286 ✭✭✭✭
    Desean Jackson
    nujerz84 wrote: »

    Eli Targets Cruz more because perhaps he gets open more and more likely to make the catch.. using the numbers Cruz has a 60% Reception rate compared to Jackson 57% reception rate over that span.

    Advantage: Cruz

    T.O. had 127 targets for us in 2004. Which was his second lowest target amount during his prime. It is the Reid offense and QB play that determines targets. When you employ a spread the ball philosophy and couple that with QBs who refuse/can't throw receivers open, numbers are hard to come by.

    DeSean is consistently one of the least targeted #1 receivers in the league. This season he received his highest target amount (while playing with his most accurate QB) and go figure, he had career highs in catches, yards and tied his td total.

    If the ball was forced to DeSean the way it is to other top receivers, it should be assumed that his stats would rise, right? I'll illustrate that...

    DeSean targets 2010-2013 (56 out of 64 possible games) - 413
    Cruz targets 2011-2013 (46 of 48) - 394
    A.J Green targets 2011-2013 (47 of 48) -457
    Julio targets 2011-2013 (34 of 48) - 282
    B. Marshall targets 2011-2013 (48 of 48) - 497 *balloons to 643 w/ previous year*
    Dez targets 2011-2013 (47 of 48) - 400
    Megatron targets 2011-2013 (46 of 48) - 518 *balloons to 655*
    Andre targets 2011-2013 (39 of 48) - 394 *balloons to 532*
    Fitz targets 2011-2013 (48 of 48) - 445 *balloons to 618*
    Welker targets 2011-2013 (45 of 48) - 458 *balloons to 581*

    In case you skimmed over all that.. I am comparing 4 years worth of targets for DeSean to 3 years of targets for everyone else.

    This is why looking at stats is lazy. It doesn't consider offensive philosophies, number of targets, type of targets ( too many of DeSean's targets are on passes that travel 25+ yards in the air, which are low probability) or QB play. It also doesn't look at whether or not a player consistently faces the #1 corner or a lesser talent while playing in the slot most of the time.


    Bottom line, DeSean is a superior overall player and at least Cruz's equal with receiving talent/ability.

    S/n: I really don't think you know what reception rate insinuates. Fitzgerald has had a reception rate of 60% once in the last 4 years (this season) with the other years being 45%, 52% and 51%. Same with Megatron, one year of 60% in his career, the rest in the 50s and one in the 40s. Terrible stat to use.
  • Already Home_17
    Already Home_17 Members Posts: 14,572 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    ? is getting real in here....
  • coop9889
    coop9889 Members Posts: 7,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2014
    Desean Jackson
    We gonna end this right here. This isn't even fair on your part.


    nujerz84 wrote: »
    You been nitpicking from the jump...this a internet forum, perhaps you should look up hyperbole/semantics and understand its meaning. He used 18% of time he still hardly used in the slot he lines up majority on the outside.

    Had you said he hardly/rarely/sometimes lines up in the slot we'd agree. You said "never". End of.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    So when you COMBINE these two points, who comes out on top in big plays? Desean. I already explained this. Lol why the ? would you separate 2011-2012 from the season that just ended?

    You're horrible at this.
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Why would you weigh one great season and not factor 2 avg seasons?
    Cruz just had his worst season of his short 3 year career. In two of his three seasons Cruz was better in the Big Play Categories...bottom line why would you dismiss that over Jackson 1 great year.
    It shows Cruz consistency in his performance as a Wide Out.

    Really? Consistency as a big play receiver? Desean was 7th, t6th, t3rd, t21st, t56th, and 2nd in catches of 20+ yards. Thats four times in the top 7 and two off years, one in which he only played 11 games.

    Cruz has been t3rd, t29th, t49th in that ranking.

    Desean is WAY more consistent in making big plays.
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    In essence you're arguing in 2011 and 2012 Desean Jackson was a better WR than Victor Cruz even the biggest Philly fan would say that not true.

    What??! If this is what you truly believe you have the comprehension skills of a rock. You're a ? idiot.

    For the love of ? stop separating 2011-2012 seasons from the 2013-2014 season.

    All I've proved is that from 2011-2013 Desean has made more big plays and has better YAC. Two things you said Cruz was better at.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Just like YAC are skewed towards amount of receptions per game we can go back and forth. If you want to use averages or totals... Cruz totals was greater.

    I can tell you're getting confused. You aren't making sense. I've used averages to state my point the entire time. Obviously Cruz TOTALS would be better because he's played more games. That's the purpose of using averages ? . A level playing field.

    And truthfully, since Cruz played more games, then the total amount of 20+ yard plays should be skewed in his favor, because he has more opportunities to make them. But even still Jackson has more. Another fail on your part.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    I posted up 4 videos that disproved that Cruz just runs Fast and catches a deep ball.

    Now why would you do that? Did I say that's all he does? Go find the quote. You pay no attention to detail which is why it's so easy for me to dissect your pile of ? arguments.

    I keep telling you you aren't intelligent enough to compete with me kid, and you keep on posting.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    My original argument from the jump was overall was that Cruz is a better WR than Jackson and he has been since he entered the NFL .

    Lol if this is the case then we are comparing apples and oranges. I said more impact as a player, you're talking solely skills as receiver.

    READ THAT SENTENCE AGAIN AND OUT LOUD.

    Just end it here and agree to disagree and spare your dignity.
  • nujerz84
    nujerz84 Members Posts: 15,418 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2014
    Victor Cruz
    coop9889 wrote: »
    We gonna end this right here. This isn't even fair on your part.






    Had you said he hardly/rarely/sometimes lines up in the slot we'd agree. You said "never". End of.

    Still arguing semantics and hyperbole/exaggeration over typed words on an internet forum, go pick up a book or take English 101.



    coop9889 wrote: »
    Really? Consistency as a big play receiver? Desean was 7th, t6th, t3rd, t21st, t56th, and 2nd in catches of 20+ yards. Thats four times in the top 7 and two off years, one in which he only played 11 games.

    Cruz has been t3rd, t29th, t49th in that ranking.

    Desean is WAY more consistent in making big plays.

    Since you want to play this game Read my post again... I stated consistency in his performance as a Wide Out his numbers in terms of receptions, receiving yards and receiving touchdowns have been more consistent and better than Jackson.
    coop9889 wrote: »
    What??! If this is what you truly believe you have the comprehension skills of a rock. You're a ? idiot.

    For the love of ? stop separating 2011-2012 seasons from the 2013-2014 season.

    All I've proved is that from 2011-2013 Desean has made more big plays and has better YAC. Two things you said Cruz was better at.

    This like the 4 post in which you hurled personal insults yet I am the one with feelings? Forget everything its simple in 2011 (also better YAC) and 2012 Cruz was the better wide receiver than DeSean Jackson even Philly Fans would agree. Jackson was much better this season.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    I can tell you're getting confused. You aren't making sense. I've used averages to state my point the entire time. Obviously Cruz TOTALS would be better because he's played more games. That's the purpose of using averages ? . A level playing field.

    And truthfully, since Cruz played more games, then the total amount of 20+ yard plays should be skewed in his favor, because he has more opportunities to make them. But even still Jackson has more. Another fail on your part.

    Desean Jackson had a monster season this year arguably his best as a WR... Cruz had his worst season as WR the numbers should go in Jackson favor. Yet in Cruz down year its nearly identical to what Desean Jackson produces per year at the Wide Receiver Position each season.


    coop9889 wrote: »
    Now why would you do that? Did I say that's all he does? Go find the quote. You pay no attention to detail which is why it's so easy for me to dissect your pile of ? arguments.

    I keep telling you you aren't intelligent enough to compete with me kid, and you keep on posting.

    Yet I been picking apart your post throughout the debate, yet you're the one not intelligent enough to know that you been arguing semantics and hyperbole from the jump while throwing personal attacks. Since you been playing the literal game throughout the debate so will I, here is your quote
    coop9889 wrote: »
    A LOT of Cruz's big catches are him simply getting behind the coverage with speed and Eli launching it.

    Nuff Said.

    coop9889 wrote: »
    Lol if this is the case then we are comparing apples and oranges. I said more impact as a player, you're talking solely skills as receiver.

    READ THAT SENTENCE AGAIN AND OUT LOUD.

    Just end it here and agree to disagree and spare your dignity.

    Considering Victor Cruz is winning the poll and my post thus far has generated more ether reactions than yours... I have won this debate.
  • coop9889
    coop9889 Members Posts: 7,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2014
    Desean Jackson
    All of the semantics ? has been proven that you don't say what you literally mean. No point in running in circles around that.

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Considering Victor Cruz is winning the poll and my post thus far has generated more ether reactions than yours... I have won this debate.

    Lol, here's a couple of people who voted for cruz.
    yall already know who I'm voting for............

    2uqjf43.jpg
    I'm a Giant fan, so honestly I'm biased
    bigev240 wrote: »
    I'm a Giant fan, so honestly I'm biased
    aneed123 wrote: »
    Cruz is the better overall wr. Jackson is better overall cuz of kick returns.


    Hmmm so a bunch of giants fans and a ? who voted for cruz who has the same exact viewpoint as me.

    Lol @ your logic of using the poll as a measuring stick when the poll doesn't even distinguish between what me and you are debating.

    "Who is the better receiver"
    "Who is the better overall player"
    "Who would you rather have on your team"

    Are 3 completely different questions and would more than likely each get a different result.

    And lol @ ethers. You would be looking at that ? and tryna take it seriously. For one, I'm way more outspoken than you and have killed lil ? like you in debate regularly so I've accrued a 'fan club' of haters. Nobody knows you.

    This debate has been done. Anything you could possibly say has already been addressed and debunked in my previous posts.



    Here's a recap of your stupidity, each being disproved with statistical data:
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Entering this past season no one had more catches, receiving yards and receiving TD heading into the 2013 season than Victor Cruz.
    7VN5Ep5.gif
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Cruz is better across the board as WR never mind the stats that prove it, the fact he works the slot and goes over the middle something DeSean Does not do.
    7VN5Ep5.gif
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Cruz is better with YAC
    7VN5Ep5.gif

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    and just as good as deep threat as Jackson,
    7VN5Ep5.gif

    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Only thing Jackson does better is special teams.
    yup.gif
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Over the past 2 seasons Heading into the 2013 season Cruz lead the entire NFL in Receptions, Receiving Yards and Rec touchdowns.
    7VN5Ep5.gif
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    Cruz has a 60% Reception rate compared to Jackson 57% reception rate over that span.
    7VN5Ep5.gif
    nujerz84 wrote: »
    His big plays and yac are less than Jackson in totality of the last three seasons, but if you judge off the 2011-2012 season, Cruz is greater in big plays.
    Smh2.gif

    Basically sums up your argument.

    It's been fun watching you struggle but I'm honestly bored with you. Go ahead and continue to miss the point and post the same things.... all of my responses from here on out will be from my previous posts. Or maybe it's gonna be a gif fest from here on out. Who knows?

    Your move.

    P.S. Dont you dare try to dispute what that Eagles fan posted above either. Save yourself. Run.
  • nujerz84
    nujerz84 Members Posts: 15,418 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    I already won doggie the fact you resorted to insults and Gifs shows me you up in your feels. As for so called haters "Kanye shrugs" for being outspoken re confirms you have a history saying ? ? .
  • O.G.
    O.G. Members Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This debate is more entertaining than the super bowl.
    Proceed.
  • coop9889
    coop9889 Members Posts: 7,299 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Desean Jackson
    O.G. wrote: »
    This debate is more entertaining than the super bowl.
    Proceed.

    1) Ive disputed nearly everything he said, and he has no new material.
    2) I'm tired of talking in circles
    3) He doesn't even know what we are truly debating.
    4) And when a new angle comes in (sheiky's post) he got overwhelmed and flustered.

    Sorry to disappoint but it's a wrap.
  • O.G.
    O.G. Members Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭✭✭
    coop9889 wrote: »

    Sorry to disappoint but it's a wrap.

    But my pizza hasn't been delivered yet.
  • Mister B.
    Mister B. Members, Writer Posts: 16,172 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Desean Jackson
    Sig!
  • R.D.
    R.D. Members Posts: 20,156 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Who's reading all of this
  • Already Home_17
    Already Home_17 Members Posts: 14,572 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    ? got this thread looking like an episode of numbers never lie
  • Billy_Poncho
    Billy_Poncho Members Posts: 22,382 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Desean Jackson
    ? , it was an ordeal scrolling through this ?
  • texasdaking88
    texasdaking88 Members Posts: 6,139 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    My thumb /lower forearm region strong as a ? from scrolling down this ? ....








    Someone should do a desean vs Torrey Smith thread
  • Shizlansky
    Shizlansky Members Posts: 35,095 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    Cruz can actually run routes
  • Inglewood_B
    Inglewood_B Members Posts: 12,246 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Desean Jackson
    My ? said he won because he got more ethers lol


    Worst side effect of these reaction buttons is ? in here begging for acceptance and being offended by bad reactions
  • Focal Point
    Focal Point Members Posts: 16,307 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    Wow I feel like I learned something and loss it and gained it back
  • blackrain
    blackrain Members, Moderators Posts: 27,269 Regulator
    As a Cowboys fan I hate both them ? but I'd take Victor Cruz. He's more consistent. I would love Desean Jackson's big play ability but it comes and goes. Plus he's already shown he can and will mentally check out of a whole season if he's not happy
  • Heavy In The Game
    Heavy In The Game Members Posts: 3,911 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Victor Cruz
    blackrain wrote: »
    As a Cowboys fan I hate both them ? but I'd take Victor Cruz. He's more consistent. I would love Desean Jackson's big play ability but it comes and goes. Plus he's already shown he can and will mentally check out of a whole season if he's not happy

    don't forget to vote bruh

    anyways I knew this would be a great debate