WTF is a pantheist?

24

Comments

  • Jabu_Rule
    Jabu_Rule Members Posts: 5,993 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    I'm a Humanist pantheist. I've expressed this very idea in argument. Nothing is proven to be ultimate but we do know that we were born within the Universe and our planet sustains us. Outside of that, i really don't care until we get there, if we get there, if there is a there..

  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    G.Avant wrote: »
    I see I'm not the only one who's interest was piqued by the use of this term in that thread the other day. It's crazy because I've already came to this conclusion on my own. I've been browsing around different forms of spirituality for a minute and now I think I can narrow my search a lil based off of forms that fall under this banner. Anybody got any recommendations for forms of spirituality that subscribe to this belief?

    Dont worship, dont pray, dont go to church.

    Th is is a belief not a religion, there are no rules and things you have to follow. Just try to live a life that makes you exceedingly happy without stepping on others peoples toes. Treat everything and everybody like you would want to be treated, i meditate, and take hallucinagins but thats not everybody. DMT IS NEXT!!!

    I took salvia once or twice, it was crazy lol...definitely something I won't do again.
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)
  • Focal Point
    Focal Point Members Posts: 16,307 ✭✭✭✭✭
    All jokes aside look into Native American and African (especially KMT) spirituality
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    All jokes aside look into Native American and African (especially KMT) spirituality

    Yeah I've been reading up on it, gets more interesting with each story I read
  • Fosheezy
    Fosheezy Members Posts: 3,204 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)

    it's fun to think about..but as agnostic after while you'd probably move on to another belief besides that
  • Jabu_Rule
    Jabu_Rule Members Posts: 5,993 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm not one for organized religion. The label of pantheist helps to at least offer a more concise attribute to how i think. At the same time, i'm not keen on using words like Spirituality. The word has been co-opted by too many and screams metaphysical rather than physical. I don't see why we have to use such a concept. Science no longer applies when we start down that road. I understand people have different concepts of the word Spiritual, but like i said, it's murky and approaches sudo-science.

    http://www.pantheism.net/atheism.htm
    Richard Dawkins, in his book The ? Delusion, has described Pantheism as "sexed-up atheism." That may seem flippant, but it is accurate. Of all religious or spiritual traditions, Pantheism - the approach of Einstein, Hawking and many other scientists - is the only one that passes the muster of the world's most militant atheist.
    So what's the difference between Atheism and Pantheism? As far as disbelief in supernatural beings, forces or realms, there is no difference. World Pantheism also shares the respect for evidence, science, and logic that's typical of atheism.

    However, Pantheism goes further, and adds to atheism an embracing, positive and reverential feeling about our lives on planet Earth, our place in Nature and the wider Universe, and uses nature as our basis for dealing with stress, grief and bereavement. It's a form of spirituality that is totally compatible with science. Indeed, since science is our best way of exploring the Universe, respect for the scientific method and fascination with the discoveries of science are an integral part of World Pantheism.
  • REV_RAGE
    REV_RAGE Members Posts: 675 ✭✭✭✭
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)

    Somewhat on this line of thinking myself, I feel there are "entities, powers, influance 'gods, angels, demons, spirits, ect.'" I also beleive there is a nucleus of power, a source, origin and or point that we all ripple out from including entities mentioned above. I also feel humanity is gifted and cursed, in some fashion or other we are the shapers of the divine/universal constant, be it through some of Jungs ideas of consciousness or otherwise. We are sshapers but are lead in some fashion to our attatchment to a source, tends to ? the other echelons of expression off because we are gifted and seem to more than often ? it away.

    Not 100% sure what I call myself but I do try to follow the tenants of "The Christ and The Buddha", atleast as a guide of how to be human and control my desires. Always kind of took to a personal form of gnostic christianity, so that puts me on beleif and philosophy over religious practice.
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    Huhm_bruh wrote: »
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)

    it's fun to think about..but as agnostic after while you'd probably move on to another belief besides that

    IDK, I've been pretty consistent with my general agnosticism for about 12 years now but I've always said if there is a higher power out there, a belief I lean towards to, then there are multiple forces. With all the crazy competition in the world, it to me makes sense that there are multiple forces out competing with each other as well. I keep an open mind I guess is what I'm trying to say.
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    REV_RAGE wrote: »
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)

    Somewhat on this line of thinking myself, I feel there are "entities, powers, influance 'gods, angels, demons, spirits, ect.'" I also beleive there is a nucleus of power, a source, origin and or point that we all ripple out from including entities mentioned above. I also feel humanity is gifted and cursed, in some fashion or other we are the shapers of the divine/universal constant, be it through some of Jungs ideas of consciousness or otherwise. We are sshapers but are lead in some fashion to our attatchment to a source, tends to ? the other echelons of expression off because we are gifted and seem to more than often ? it away.

    Not 100% sure what I call myself but I do try to follow the tenants of "The Christ and The Buddha", atleast as a guide of how to be human and control my desires. Always kind of took to a personal form of gnostic christianity, so that puts me on beleif and philosophy over religious practice.

    I'm much in line with this, I considered myself Buddhist for a long time. Stopped being Christian at age 16 or 17 but I admit I do admire some of the good things Jesus did. Not a fan of some of his words in the Bible but he treated people on a humane basis and I try (my best) to do the same.

    I tend to believe there are different forms of spirits, powers and entities out there. Whether one can call them "gods" is questionable to me (maybe any gods or ? we have is dead) but I do believe some force in the universe out there is beyond us and it is part of our wider consciousness. Gnostic Christianity is very interesting, but I'm generally skeptical about Christianity in general. Mostly cuz Jesus said he would come back quickly and 2,000 years later, he still isn't protecting his followers as he claimed he would. He couldn't even convince most of his fellow Jews he was lord, but again he was a good man deep down I think.
  • Jabu_Rule
    Jabu_Rule Members Posts: 5,993 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Huhm_bruh wrote: »
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)

    it's fun to think about..but as agnostic after while you'd probably move on to another belief besides that

    IDK, I've been pretty consistent with my general agnosticism for about 12 years now but I've always said if there is a higher power out there, a belief I lean towards to, then there are multiple forces. With all the crazy competition in the world, it to me makes sense that there are multiple forces out competing with each other as well. I keep an open mind I guess is what I'm trying to say.

    There are. Space is always a competition. Gravity is the result. Planetary bodies fight for dominance when they orbit larger planets and suns. There is a constant tug in pull. Galaxies are always colliding, asteroids impacting, and new elements are formed from the chaotic end of suns. Then there are black holes. Just like nature, it's a balance of nature that is actually a war of attrition. There are Suns so large, that our Sun appears as an ameeba. These things occur without purpose. They just are.
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    FuriousOne wrote: »
    Huhm_bruh wrote: »
    Does anyone here believe that there are multiple gods or higher powers...? I tend to go this route, other days I'm agnostic in general but still I think there's something out there beyond us (most of the time)

    it's fun to think about..but as agnostic after while you'd probably move on to another belief besides that

    IDK, I've been pretty consistent with my general agnosticism for about 12 years now but I've always said if there is a higher power out there, a belief I lean towards to, then there are multiple forces. With all the crazy competition in the world, it to me makes sense that there are multiple forces out competing with each other as well. I keep an open mind I guess is what I'm trying to say.

    There are. Space is always a competition. Gravity is the result. Planetary bodies fight for dominance when they orbit larger planets and suns. There is a constant tug in pull. Galaxies are always colliding, asteroids impacting, and new elements are formed from the chaotic end of suns. Then there are black holes. Just like nature, it's a balance of nature that is actually a war of attrition. There are Suns so large, that our Sun appears as an ameeba. These things occur without purpose. They just are.

    Great points, perhaps some things are just what they are without a purpose. In the end, there really isn't a true purpose in life except for what you make it. And even then purposes change, depending on what is important for the moment (or what isn't important anymore). Nature works the same way.
  • The_Jackal
    The_Jackal Members Posts: 3,628 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Some heathen pagen ? .
  • not_osirus_jenkins
    not_osirus_jenkins Members, Banned Users Posts: 3,670 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    it sounds to me that pantheism is a lot like the minbari religion from babylon 5

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ap0-uO8h2OU
  • 700
    700 Members Posts: 14,496 ✭✭✭✭✭
    FuriousOne wrote: »
    I'm not one for organized religion. The label of pantheist helps to at least offer a more concise attribute to how i think. At the same time, i'm not keen on using words like Spirituality. The word has been co-opted by too many and screams metaphysical rather than physical. I don't see why we have to use such a concept. Science no longer applies when we start down that road. I understand people have different concepts of the word Spiritual, but like i said, it's murky and approaches sudo-science.

    http://www.pantheism.net/atheism.htm
    Richard Dawkins, in his book The ? Delusion, has described Pantheism as "sexed-up atheism." That may seem flippant, but it is accurate. Of all religious or spiritual traditions, Pantheism - the approach of Einstein, Hawking and many other scientists - is the only one that passes the muster of the world's most militant atheist.
    So what's the difference between Atheism and Pantheism? As far as disbelief in supernatural beings, forces or realms, there is no difference. World Pantheism also shares the respect for evidence, science, and logic that's typical of atheism.

    However, Pantheism goes further, and adds to atheism an embracing, positive and reverential feeling about our lives on planet Earth, our place in Nature and the wider Universe, and uses nature as our basis for dealing with stress, grief and bereavement. It's a form of spirituality that is totally compatible with science. Indeed, since science is our best way of exploring the Universe, respect for the scientific method and fascination with the discoveries of science are an integral part of World Pantheism.

    best post in here

    ill go with this, explains it perfectly to me
  • not_osirus_jenkins
    not_osirus_jenkins Members, Banned Users Posts: 3,670 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.

    i don't need much facts for this simple logic will be enough

    The christian ? punishes the sin of worshiping other gods

    pagan christmas included the worship of pagan gods
    christian christmas does not.
    pagan easter included the worship of pagan gods
    christian easter does not.

    Therefore a christian observing christmas or easter while adhering to the doctrine of his religion is in no danger or hell fire at least not for his observance. I COULD give you more scriptural proof to prove your statement wrong but it would be a waste on someone like you
  • Jabu_Rule
    Jabu_Rule Members Posts: 5,993 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    zombie wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.

    i don't need much facts for this simple logic will be enough

    The christian ? punishes the sin of worshiping other gods

    pagan christmas included the worship of pagan gods
    christian christmas does not.
    pagan easter included the worship of pagan gods
    christian easter does not.

    Therefore a christian observing christmas or easter while adhering to the doctrine of his religion is in no danger or hell fire at least not for his observance. I COULD give you more scriptural proof to prove your statement wrong but it would be a waste on someone like you

    There is no worshiping of any ? during those days. It's all about Jesus, unless you feel Jesus is ? . Many have gone to war over that little detail. Beyond that, the traditions that are being utilized are indeed pagan in Origin. First, there is the date and time which are not accurate to the time that Jesus either was born or died. Second those dates are around celestial events. Many cultures celebrated around the time of Christmas for the Winter Solstice. During the time of Jesus, the Romans used a completely different Calendar which is why many historical dates after that are thrown off. England was actually one of the last to change along with their colonies (America). The Eastern orthodox still use the Julian Calender so their dates are different for celebration. Christmas for the Orthodox was is January 7th.

    http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/us/orthodox-christmas-day

    The Pagan traditions used the Mistletoe and Christmas tree with decorations. Pegan traditions were included to attract German barbarians. Funny enough, it was the cult of Saint Nicholas that bought Christianity to them and made the alterations to fit.

    http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/Christmas_TheRealStory.htm

    Easter is a worse offender because it actually uses the name of the Pagan ? Eostre which is represented by a rabbit. It is held around the time of the Spring Equinox. There was also the fact that in Rome the ? born ? Attis was celebrated and he died and rose again annually.

    eostre.jpg

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2010/apr/03/easter-pagan-symbolism


    Then there is the Holiday that you don't even want to accept anymore. Halloween or All hollows eve which was once Samhein which was celebrated on the 31st and at the end of the Summer. Somehow, this holiday has become a symbol of evil. Costumes, Goodies (fruits and nuts), spooky stories, and jack-o-lanterns came from these traditions. This tradition celebrating the previous harvest and warding away wicked spirits to protect the next harvest. Of course, Christians adopted to traditions to more easily spread their faith. They wanted that day to be a remembrance of the dead, saints and Martyrs.

    http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/onlinediscipleship/halloween/halloween_Pagan_Ankerberg.aspx
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    FuriousOne wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.

    i don't need much facts for this simple logic will be enough

    The christian ? punishes the sin of worshiping other gods

    pagan christmas included the worship of pagan gods
    christian christmas does not.
    pagan easter included the worship of pagan gods
    christian easter does not.

    Therefore a christian observing christmas or easter while adhering to the doctrine of his religion is in no danger or hell fire at least not for his observance. I COULD give you more scriptural proof to prove your statement wrong but it would be a waste on someone like you

    There is no worshiping of any ? during those days. It's all about Jesus, unless you feel Jesus is ? . Many have gone to war over that little detail. Beyond that, the traditions that are being utilized are indeed pagan in Origin. First, there is the date and time which are not accurate to the time that Jesus either was born or died. Second those dates are around celestial events. Many cultures celebrated around the time of Christmas for the Winter Solstice. During the time of Jesus, the Romans used a completely different Calendar which is why many historical dates after that are thrown off. England was actually one of the last to change along with their colonies (America). The Eastern orthodox still use the Julian Calender so their dates are different for celebration. Christmas for the Orthodox was is January 7th.

    http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/us/orthodox-christmas-day

    The Pagan traditions used the Mistletoe and Christmas tree with decorations. Pegan traditions were included to attract German barbarians. Funny enough, it was the cult of Saint Nicholas that bought Christianity to them and made the alterations to fit.

    http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/Christmas_TheRealStory.htm

    Easter is a worse offender because it actually uses the name of the Pagan ? Eostre which is represented by a rabbit. It is held around the time of the Spring Equinox. There was also the fact that in Rome the ? born ? Attis was celebrated and he died and rose again annually.

    eostre.jpg

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2010/apr/03/easter-pagan-symbolism


    Then there is the Holiday that you don't even want to accept anymore. Halloween or All hollows eve which was once Samhein which was celebrated on the 31st and at the end of the Summer. Somehow, this holiday has become a symbol of evil. Costumes, Goodies (fruits and nuts), spooky stories, and jack-o-lanterns came from these traditions. This tradition celebrating the previous harvest and warding away wicked spirits to protect the next harvest. Of course, Christians adopted to traditions to more easily spread their faith. They wanted that day to be a remembrance of the dead, saints and Martyrs.

    http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/onlinediscipleship/halloween/halloween_Pagan_Ankerberg.aspx

    Smh I never argued that the origins of the traditions were not pagan and thanks for the information but it's irrelevant to the actual point.
  • Jabu_Rule
    Jabu_Rule Members Posts: 5,993 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
    zombie wrote: »
    FuriousOne wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.

    i don't need much facts for this simple logic will be enough

    The christian ? punishes the sin of worshiping other gods

    pagan christmas included the worship of pagan gods
    christian christmas does not.
    pagan easter included the worship of pagan gods
    christian easter does not.

    Therefore a christian observing christmas or easter while adhering to the doctrine of his religion is in no danger or hell fire at least not for his observance. I COULD give you more scriptural proof to prove your statement wrong but it would be a waste on someone like you

    There is no worshiping of any ? during those days. It's all about Jesus, unless you feel Jesus is ? . Many have gone to war over that little detail. Beyond that, the traditions that are being utilized are indeed pagan in Origin. First, there is the date and time which are not accurate to the time that Jesus either was born or died. Second those dates are around celestial events. Many cultures celebrated around the time of Christmas for the Winter Solstice. During the time of Jesus, the Romans used a completely different Calendar which is why many historical dates after that are thrown off. England was actually one of the last to change along with their colonies (America). The Eastern orthodox still use the Julian Calender so their dates are different for celebration. Christmas for the Orthodox was is January 7th.

    http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/us/orthodox-christmas-day

    The Pagan traditions used the Mistletoe and Christmas tree with decorations. Pegan traditions were included to attract German barbarians. Funny enough, it was the cult of Saint Nicholas that bought Christianity to them and made the alterations to fit.

    http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/Christmas_TheRealStory.htm

    Easter is a worse offender because it actually uses the name of the Pagan ? Eostre which is represented by a rabbit. It is held around the time of the Spring Equinox. There was also the fact that in Rome the ? born ? Attis was celebrated and he died and rose again annually.

    eostre.jpg

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2010/apr/03/easter-pagan-symbolism


    Then there is the Holiday that you don't even want to accept anymore. Halloween or All hollows eve which was once Samhein which was celebrated on the 31st and at the end of the Summer. Somehow, this holiday has become a symbol of evil. Costumes, Goodies (fruits and nuts), spooky stories, and jack-o-lanterns came from these traditions. This tradition celebrating the previous harvest and warding away wicked spirits to protect the next harvest. Of course, Christians adopted to traditions to more easily spread their faith. They wanted that day to be a remembrance of the dead, saints and Martyrs.

    http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/onlinediscipleship/halloween/halloween_Pagan_Ankerberg.aspx

    Smh I never argued that the origins of the traditions were not pagan and thanks for the information but it's irrelevant to the actual point.


    Touche. I was going to let that slide but, you don't think it's problematic to celebrate the religions of other Gods? You think it's cool to co-opt other religions and incorrectly (date wise) superimpose a Christian religion on top of another religion while keeping all the things that represents the other ? and not your ? ?

    @zombie
  • not_osirus_jenkins
    not_osirus_jenkins Members, Banned Users Posts: 3,670 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zombie wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    ome heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.

    i don't need much facts for this simple logic will be enough

    The christian ? punishes the sin of worshiping other gods

    pagan christmas included the worship of pagan gods
    christian christmas does not.
    pagan easter included the worship of pagan gods
    christian easter does not.

    Therefore a christian observing christmas or easter while adhering to the doctrine of his religion is in no danger or hell fire at least not for his observance. I COULD give you more scriptural proof to prove your statement wrong but it would be a waste on someone like you

    And worshipping false idols. Worshipping can be construed as broad terms, you know kinda how you Christians always have a passage that fits what you're trying to preach. The fact that you put up pagan symbols in your house could be worship. The fact that you put your gifts under the tree as its the centerpiece of festivities could be interpreted as worship. All of these are pagan symbols. Just be christians adopted them doesnt make them any less than what they were intended to be. and christians dont use logic, your book is the infallible truth yet snakes can talk and people can live in whales for 3 days and the story of creation is physically impossible.
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2015
  • zombie
    zombie Members Posts: 13,450 ✭✭✭✭✭
    FuriousOne wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    FuriousOne wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    zombie wrote: »
    The_Jackal wrote: »
    Some heathen pagen ? .

    All of your religious holidays and practices are from pagan beliefs. If you celebrate easter or christmas you are pagan and your ? is gonna send you to hell for it.

    THAT'S COMPLETE FALSEHOOD.

    Facts bruh, dispute me with facts.

    i don't need much facts for this simple logic will be enough

    The christian ? punishes the sin of worshiping other gods

    pagan christmas included the worship of pagan gods
    christian christmas does not.
    pagan easter included the worship of pagan gods
    christian easter does not.

    Therefore a christian observing christmas or easter while adhering to the doctrine of his religion is in no danger or hell fire at least not for his observance. I COULD give you more scriptural proof to prove your statement wrong but it would be a waste on someone like you

    There is no worshiping of any ? during those days. It's all about Jesus, unless you feel Jesus is ? . Many have gone to war over that little detail. Beyond that, the traditions that are being utilized are indeed pagan in Origin. First, there is the date and time which are not accurate to the time that Jesus either was born or died. Second those dates are around celestial events. Many cultures celebrated around the time of Christmas for the Winter Solstice. During the time of Jesus, the Romans used a completely different Calendar which is why many historical dates after that are thrown off. England was actually one of the last to change along with their colonies (America). The Eastern orthodox still use the Julian Calender so their dates are different for celebration. Christmas for the Orthodox was is January 7th.

    http://www.timeanddate.com/holidays/us/orthodox-christmas-day

    The Pagan traditions used the Mistletoe and Christmas tree with decorations. Pegan traditions were included to attract German barbarians. Funny enough, it was the cult of Saint Nicholas that bought Christianity to them and made the alterations to fit.

    http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/Christmas_TheRealStory.htm

    Easter is a worse offender because it actually uses the name of the Pagan ? Eostre which is represented by a rabbit. It is held around the time of the Spring Equinox. There was also the fact that in Rome the ? born ? Attis was celebrated and he died and rose again annually.

    eostre.jpg

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/belief/2010/apr/03/easter-pagan-symbolism


    Then there is the Holiday that you don't even want to accept anymore. Halloween or All hollows eve which was once Samhein which was celebrated on the 31st and at the end of the Summer. Somehow, this holiday has become a symbol of evil. Costumes, Goodies (fruits and nuts), spooky stories, and jack-o-lanterns came from these traditions. This tradition celebrating the previous harvest and warding away wicked spirits to protect the next harvest. Of course, Christians adopted to traditions to more easily spread their faith. They wanted that day to be a remembrance of the dead, saints and Martyrs.

    http://www.cbn.com/spirituallife/onlinediscipleship/halloween/halloween_Pagan_Ankerberg.aspx

    Smh I never argued that the origins of the traditions were not pagan and thanks for the information but it's irrelevant to the actual point.


    Touche. I was going to let that slide but, you don't think it's problematic to celebrate the religions of other Gods? You think it's cool to co-opt other religions and incorrectly (date wise) superimpose a Christian religion on top of another religion while keeping all the things that represents the other ? and not your ? ?

    @zombie

    but we are not celebrating those other gods we are celebrating our ? using their traditions and the things we use in those celebration no longer represent those other gods in our hearts.

    19 Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from ? ’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.
    1 corinthians 9