Who are you voting for: Bernie Sanders or Hilary Clinton?

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  • (ob)Scene
    (ob)Scene Members Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bernie Sanders
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.
  • HundredEyes
    HundredEyes Members Posts: 2,959 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zzombie wrote: »
    Holland is the most capitalistic, entrepeneur/trade country on the planet. Yet its considered a 'social democracy'...due to the relatively high tax system, social securities and facilities are top notch...(from public transport/infrastructure to healthcare, education etc)...Im talking high speed trains, Mercedes Benz hybrid busses, superb roads, top ranking universities and hospitals....and job benefits(secundary work benefits ftw), pensions etc etc.

    Holland is also the most multicultural country on the planet...your broke? Doesnt matter your kids can go to any university they want, get the best healthcare and make a shitload of money

    but the system only works, in small countries like Holland, countries with transparent political systems, America is to one sided, to violent and to big...but states could follow the scandinivian or Dutch models...individual states can pull it off...

    There are individual states in America that are larger and more economically powerful than whole European nations. Americans cannot just copy western Europe and it makes no sense to do so

    the port of Rotterdam is the third biggest port worldwide, bigger than any US Port, used to be the biggest in trade but has been surpassed by respectively Hong Kong and Shanghai....there are literally more companies settled in Rotterdam than there are people living in the city lol...u know who has the biggest port for chemicals/natural gas/earthly resources? Amsterdam.

    matter a fact, after the US, Holland is the nr.2 export nation in the world...wrap your head around that son. They export more than allmost all every single state in the US...yet Holland is only 16 million strong compared to 300mill in the US...Dutch companies like Unilever etc basically controll 1/3rd of the worlds foodsupply...

    many multinational companies, including American ones like Apple for example have set up shop in Holland due to the low taxes for businesses...Holland is renown worldwide as a taxhaven for int companies.

    The Netherlands is lightyears a head compared to the US and China in a lot of aspects...

    while youre still discussing the evils of socialism and kapitalism, you fail to grasp that privatising prisons has been a disaster for your society and there are countries like Holland that have superior models regarding law/prisons, healthcare, infrastructure, water management, education etc etc...

    your nation is building fresh prisons while countries like Holland are closing prisons every year...

    but you think its 'socialist' of your government to cut a couple % of from example the military budget and invest it into the actual country...aint no prison lobby groups sponsoring your favourite presidential candidate in Holland...think about that for a second and see what is truelly inhumane and evil here son.
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2015
    Other
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2015
    Other
    zzombie wrote: »
    Holland is the most capitalistic, entrepeneur/trade country on the planet. Yet its considered a 'social democracy'...due to the relatively high tax system, social securities and facilities are top notch...(from public transport/infrastructure to healthcare, education etc)...Im talking high speed trains, Mercedes Benz hybrid busses, superb roads, top ranking universities and hospitals....and job benefits(secundary work benefits ftw), pensions etc etc.

    Holland is also the most multicultural country on the planet...your broke? Doesnt matter your kids can go to any university they want, get the best healthcare and make a shitload of money

    but the system only works, in small countries like Holland, countries with transparent political systems, America is to one sided, to violent and to big...but states could follow the scandinivian or Dutch models...individual states can pull it off...

    There are individual states in America that are larger and more economically powerful than whole European nations. Americans cannot just copy western Europe and it makes no sense to do so

    the port of Rotterdam is the third biggest port worldwide, bigger than any US Port, used to be the biggest in trade but has been surpassed by respectively Hong Kong and Shanghai....there are literally more companies settled in Rotterdam than there are people living in the city lol...u know who has the biggest port for chemicals/natural gas/earthly resources? Amsterdam.

    matter a fact, after the US, Holland is the nr.2 export nation in the world...wrap your head around that son. They export more than allmost all every single state in the US...yet Holland is only 16 million strong compared to 300mill in the US...Dutch companies like Unilever etc basically controll 1/3rd of the worlds foodsupply...

    many multinational companies, including American ones like Apple for example have set up shop in Holland due to the low taxes for businesses...Holland is renown worldwide as a taxhaven for int companies.

    The Netherlands is lightyears a head compared to the US and China in a lot of aspects...

    while youre still discussing the evils of socialism and kapitalism, you fail to grasp that privatising prisons has been a disaster for your society and there are countries like Holland that have superior models regarding law/prisons, healthcare, infrastructure, water management, education etc etc...

    your nation is building fresh prisons while countries like Holland are closing prisons every year...

    but you think its 'socialist' of your government to cut a couple % of from example the military budget and invest it into the actual country...aint no prison lobby groups sponsoring your favourite presidential candidate in Holland...think about that for a second and see what is truelly inhumane and evil here son.

    The netherlands is smaller than texas and your entire population can fit in the tri-state area

    for all the great things the netherlands it's economy is pathetic when compared with the usa. Your size gives you certain advantages and problems our size does the same thing for us, we cannot adopt your system the same way you are incapable of adopting ours. You can have large sections of a population being happy with the infrastructure when the nation is small and rich and is also surrounded by rich nations.

    You are bragging about companies setting up shop in your nation but don't you notice that almost none of those world class, world wide corporations actually come from the netherlands. You don't see that your prosperity is actually the result of other nations and not totally a result of your political and economic system. where is The netherlands version of APPLE or facebook or tesla or disney or mircosoft etc etc etc companies that are world wide and popular who lead and innovate in their markets. You don't have much companies like these probably because your economic,social and political system cannot create any or at least they cannot make any that can compete with other nations.

    also you can afford to close prisons because firstly you don't share a border with the worlds #1 illegal drug producer and you have a population in decline and you don't have to spend money on a large military because of nato and nato is basically funded by the united states. MANY europeans states live off our money and business success and then brag about how great they are doing ignoring the fact that it is ameica that is largely responsible for their well being
  • Mr.LV
    Mr.LV Members Posts: 14,089 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bernie Sanders
    States GDP equivalent to countries
    400px-Comparison_between_U.S._states_and_countries_by_GDP_in_2012.jpg
  • usmarin3
    usmarin3 Members Posts: 38,013 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This ? is like the 2000 NBA draft.

  • (ob)Scene
    (ob)Scene Members Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bernie Sanders
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.
  • NCswag
    NCswag Members Posts: 2,823 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Weekend at bernies for me. Hillary on a female attitude will cause ww3. Trump pulling a foreign nation's card will cause ww3. Jeb bush even having his goofy ass family face in Europe will cause ww3. Biden would die in office of old ? stroke. Christie would die of fat ? stroke.
  • jono
    jono Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The government produces nothing, it provides services. Public entities are more often than not nonprofit and cannot operate the same as a business.

    Thats the problem in this country right now. Its why counties, cities and even whole states are underwater as we speak.
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2015
    Other
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.
  • HundredEyes
    HundredEyes Members Posts: 2,959 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zzombie wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    Holland is the most capitalistic, entrepeneur/trade country on the planet. Yet its considered a 'social democracy'...due to the relatively high tax system, social securities and facilities are top notch...(from public transport/infrastructure to healthcare, education etc)...Im talking high speed trains, Mercedes Benz hybrid busses, superb roads, top ranking universities and hospitals....and job benefits(secundary work benefits ftw), pensions etc etc.

    Holland is also the most multicultural country on the planet...your broke? Doesnt matter your kids can go to any university they want, get the best healthcare and make a shitload of money

    but the system only works, in small countries like Holland, countries with transparent political systems, America is to one sided, to violent and to big...but states could follow the scandinivian or Dutch models...individual states can pull it off...

    There are individual states in America that are larger and more economically powerful than whole European nations. Americans cannot just copy western Europe and it makes no sense to do so

    the port of Rotterdam is the third biggest port worldwide, bigger than any US Port, used to be the biggest in trade but has been surpassed by respectively Hong Kong and Shanghai....there are literally more companies settled in Rotterdam than there are people living in the city lol...u know who has the biggest port for chemicals/natural gas/earthly resources? Amsterdam.

    matter a fact, after the US, Holland is the nr.2 export nation in the world...wrap your head around that son. They export more than allmost all every single state in the US...yet Holland is only 16 million strong compared to 300mill in the US...Dutch companies like Unilever etc basically controll 1/3rd of the worlds foodsupply...

    many multinational companies, including American ones like Apple for example have set up shop in Holland due to the low taxes for businesses...Holland is renown worldwide as a taxhaven for int companies.

    The Netherlands is lightyears a head compared to the US and China in a lot of aspects...

    while youre still discussing the evils of socialism and kapitalism, you fail to grasp that privatising prisons has been a disaster for your society and there are countries like Holland that have superior models regarding law/prisons, healthcare, infrastructure, water management, education etc etc...

    your nation is building fresh prisons while countries like Holland are closing prisons every year...

    but you think its 'socialist' of your government to cut a couple % of from example the military budget and invest it into the actual country...aint no prison lobby groups sponsoring your favourite presidential candidate in Holland...think about that for a second and see what is truelly inhumane and evil here son.

    The netherlands is smaller than texas and your entire population can fit in the tri-state area

    for all the great things the netherlands it's economy is pathetic when compared with the usa. Your size gives you certain advantages and problems our size does the same thing for us, we cannot adopt your system the same way you are incapable of adopting ours. You can have large sections of a population being happy with the infrastructure when the nation is small and rich and is also surrounded by rich nations.

    You are bragging about companies setting up shop in your nation but don't you notice that almost none of those world class, world wide corporations actually come from the netherlands. You don't see that your prosperity is actually the result of other nations and not totally a result of your political and economic system. where is The netherlands version of APPLE or facebook or tesla or disney or mircosoft etc etc etc companies that are world wide and popular who lead and innovate in their markets. You don't have much companies like these probably because your economic,social and political system cannot create any or at least they cannot make any that can compete with other nations.

    also you can afford to close prisons because firstly you don't share a border with the worlds #1 illegal drug producer and you have a population in decline and you don't have to spend money on a large military because of nato and nato is basically funded by the united states. MANY europeans states live off our money and business success and then brag about how great they are doing ignoring the fact that it is ameica that is largely responsible for their well being

    bro do some research, The Netherlands made themselves back in the VOC days, the first multinational company which was worth allmost 8 trillion euros in todays value(more than microsoft, apple, tesla, facebook, general motors n disney combined)...invented the modern day stock market when north america was still owned by the natives...
    There are hundreds of Dutch multinational companies like Unilever, Philips, Heineken, Frisian Flag, Bam, DSM, Akzo Nobel etc...do a google search.

    or are you willingly just ignoring my point of the flaws in having a private prisons? Sharing a border with mexico aint got ? to do with that. Youre also ignoring the fact and my point that 'socialist' holland is exactly heaven for multinationals, entrepeneurship/trade in general...

    America is not largely responsible for the well being of the EU btw. EU is self sustaining(unlike the US and China)...over 90% of the trade stays and comes from within the continent(which is a population of over 500 million people, 200 million more than the US), Holland trades more with Germany and Italy than with America and China...except for MS, Apple, what are the other american brands Europeans rock? Now turn the tables, how many Americans rock European Clothes? European cars? European food? No one drives a dodge or chevy in Europe, no one rocks american clothes etc etc. Not as much as Americans rock euro ? .

    you know how everything nowadays has a 'made in china' logo, well there is a 33% chance that whatever food and drinks you just had or u buy at your local supermarket, was produced by a dutch company...

    Wake up bro, the EU/Europe has a stronger and bigger economy than the US has...yall are so deep in debt its ridiculous, your Federal Reserve is a private owned bank owned by mostly Europeans. Think about that.

    Apple is cool and all, but yesterday it was all Nokia vs Sony Ericson, todays its apple vs. Samsung, tomorrow is Huawei etc. Companies like Unilever and Daimler Benz have been here since we were all born.
  • HundredEyes
    HundredEyes Members Posts: 2,959 ✭✭✭✭✭
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.

    it are meso, mikro and makro levels and the whole problem with the whole /supply n demand in new york is that if a plumber for example or people with low level income cannot afford to live in the city anymore eventhough the city(and every city) needs them...if nyc doesnt watch out, theyre gonna be on dubai/migrant workers ? , were all the fundamental but low paid jobs are done by people from outside de state or country even, because the real/native new yorkers with low paying jobs cannot afford the minimum living expenses etc...

    there is always regulation/corruption/market control, no such thing as a free market or that the market will take care of itself....demand and supply are created, especially by real estate moguls...
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2015
    Other
    zzombie wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    Holland is the most capitalistic, entrepeneur/trade country on the planet. Yet its considered a 'social democracy'...due to the relatively high tax system, social securities and facilities are top notch...(from public transport/infrastructure to healthcare, education etc)...Im talking high speed trains, Mercedes Benz hybrid busses, superb roads, top ranking universities and hospitals....and job benefits(secundary work benefits ftw), pensions etc etc.

    Holland is also the most multicultural country on the planet...your broke? Doesnt matter your kids can go to any university they want, get the best healthcare and make a shitload of money

    but the system only works, in small countries like Holland, countries with transparent political systems, America is to one sided, to violent and to big...but states could follow the scandinivian or Dutch models...individual states can pull it off...

    There are individual states in America that are larger and more economically powerful than whole European nations. Americans cannot just copy western Europe and it makes no sense to do so

    the port of Rotterdam is the third biggest port worldwide, bigger than any US Port, used to be the biggest in trade but has been surpassed by respectively Hong Kong and Shanghai....there are literally more companies settled in Rotterdam than there are people living in the city lol...u know who has the biggest port for chemicals/natural gas/earthly resources? Amsterdam.

    matter a fact, after the US, Holland is the nr.2 export nation in the world...wrap your head around that son. They export more than allmost all every single state in the US...yet Holland is only 16 million strong compared to 300mill in the US...Dutch companies like Unilever etc basically controll 1/3rd of the worlds foodsupply...

    many multinational companies, including American ones like Apple for example have set up shop in Holland due to the low taxes for businesses...Holland is renown worldwide as a taxhaven for int companies.

    The Netherlands is lightyears a head compared to the US and China in a lot of aspects...

    while youre still discussing the evils of socialism and kapitalism, you fail to grasp that privatising prisons has been a disaster for your society and there are countries like Holland that have superior models regarding law/prisons, healthcare, infrastructure, water management, education etc etc...

    your nation is building fresh prisons while countries like Holland are closing prisons every year...

    but you think its 'socialist' of your government to cut a couple % of from example the military budget and invest it into the actual country...aint no prison lobby groups sponsoring your favourite presidential candidate in Holland...think about that for a second and see what is truelly inhumane and evil here son.

    The netherlands is smaller than texas and your entire population can fit in the tri-state area

    for all the great things the netherlands it's economy is pathetic when compared with the usa. Your size gives you certain advantages and problems our size does the same thing for us, we cannot adopt your system the same way you are incapable of adopting ours. You can have large sections of a population being happy with the infrastructure when the nation is small and rich and is also surrounded by rich nations.

    You are bragging about companies setting up shop in your nation but don't you notice that almost none of those world class, world wide corporations actually come from the netherlands. You don't see that your prosperity is actually the result of other nations and not totally a result of your political and economic system. where is The netherlands version of APPLE or facebook or tesla or disney or mircosoft etc etc etc companies that are world wide and popular who lead and innovate in their markets. You don't have much companies like these probably because your economic,social and political system cannot create any or at least they cannot make any that can compete with other nations.

    also you can afford to close prisons because firstly you don't share a border with the worlds #1 illegal drug producer and you have a population in decline and you don't have to spend money on a large military because of nato and nato is basically funded by the united states. MANY europeans states live off our money and business success and then brag about how great they are doing ignoring the fact that it is ameica that is largely responsible for their well being

    bro do some research, The Netherlands made themselves back in the VOC days, the first multinational company which was worth allmost 8 trillion euros in todays value(more than microsoft, apple, tesla, facebook, general motors n disney combined)...invented the modern day stock market when north america was still owned by the natives...
    There are hundreds of Dutch multinational companies like Unilever, Philips, Heineken, Frisian Flag, Bam, DSM, Akzo Nobel etc...do a google search.

    or are you willingly just ignoring my point of the flaws in having a private prisons? Sharing a border with mexico aint got ? to do with that. Youre also ignoring the fact and my point that 'socialist' holland is exactly heaven for multinationals, entrepeneurship/trade in general...

    America is not largely responsible for the well being of the EU btw. EU is self sustaining(unlike the US and China)...over 90% of the trade stays and comes from within the continent(which is a population of over 500 million people, 200 million more than the US), Holland trades more with Germany and Italy than with America and China...except for MS, Apple, what are the other american brands Europeans rock? Now turn the tables, how many Americans rock European Clothes? European cars? European food? No one drives a dodge or chevy in Europe, no one rocks american clothes etc etc. Not as much as Americans rock euro ? .

    you know how everything nowadays has a 'made in china' logo, well there is a 33% chance that whatever food and drinks you just had or u buy at your local supermarket, was produced by a dutch company...

    Wake up bro, the EU/Europe has a stronger and bigger economy than the US has...yall are so deep in debt its ridiculous, your Federal Reserve is a private owned bank owned by mostly Europeans. Think about that.

    Apple is cool and all, but yesterday it was all Nokia vs Sony Ericson, todays its apple vs. Samsung, tomorrow is Huawei etc. Companies like Unilever and Daimler Benz have been here since we were all born.

    What the ? are you telling me about ancient history for??? the first multinational companies all came from europe SO what it's not 1863 or whenever that was.

    There are multinational companies all over the globe but you are missing my point none of those corporations you mentioned rivial their american counterparts and the netherlands is not a haven for enterpership which is the reason why you don't very few corporations that rivial american ones.

    The EU is currently looking flabby and sick SO what the ? are you talking about?? unemployment in spain is over 20% in italy it's 13% in portugal it's 17% in france it's 10%.

    LETS STOP THE ? AND LOOK AT THE NUMBERS http://money.cnn.com/infographic/news/economy/us-versus-europe-economy/

    http://money.cnn.com/news/economy/world_economies_gdp/

    HAVING a larger economy does not mean you have the best economy or one that is growing
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Other
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.

    it are meso, mikro and makro levels and the whole problem with the whole /supply n demand in new york is that if a plumber for example or people with low level income cannot afford to live in the city anymore eventhough the city(and every city) needs them...if nyc doesnt watch out, theyre gonna be on dubai/migrant workers ? , were all the fundamental but low paid jobs are done by people from outside de state or country even, because the real/native new yorkers with low paying jobs cannot afford the minimum living expenses etc...

    there is always regulation/corruption/market control, no such thing as a free market or that the market will take care of itself....demand and supply are created, especially by real estate moguls...

    I would never deny that there is a problem but you cannot fix this problem simply by increasing wages because to do so with out increasing supply will only make ? worse. federal government dictating the how much employers pay creates problems.

    If the government did it's job we would have a free market
  • (ob)Scene
    (ob)Scene Members Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bernie Sanders
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.


    That goes directly back to my explanation of low income families being pushed out of the city though. Why do you believe the supply of housing in NY is less than the demand?
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Other
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.


    That goes directly back to my explanation of low income families being pushed out of the city though. Why do you believe the supply of housing in NY is less than the demand?

    well first of all there is a natural limit on space which limits supply second of all building in nyc is a hard for smaller firms because of soo many regulations with zoning and permits and taxes and extra ? and on top of that there is competition from big and small companies. ULTIMATELY the supply cannot keep up with the demand.
  • (ob)Scene
    (ob)Scene Members Posts: 4,729 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bernie Sanders
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.


    That goes directly back to my explanation of low income families being pushed out of the city though. Why do you believe the supply of housing in NY is less than the demand?

    well first of all there is a natural limit on space which limits supply second of all building in nyc is a hard for smaller firms because of soo many regulations with zoning and permits and taxes and extra ? and on top of that there is competition from big and small companies. ULTIMATELY the supply cannot keep up with the demand.

    I was referring to what increased the demand... because this wasn't as big of an issue in NY 15-20 years ago.
  • HundredEyes
    HundredEyes Members Posts: 2,959 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Dutch companies actually do rival and surpass their US counterparts but youre just ignoring Most of my post anyway bro hahaha @zombie

    just like u ignore the numbers in the links u hooked us up with. Combined the European nations are larger economy wise and Eastern Europe has massive economic potential, but it will take a generation before they rival their western and northern european counterparts...Im hoping the US doesnt outsource to much and the lesser states will rise to(in the end were allies anyway)...

    I think the whole world is looking flabby and sick economy wise at the moment, but high unemployment rates of spain and italy, doesnt mean much for Holland and Germany at the moment.

    honestly though, Im mostly worried the Chinese will slow and drag 'us' (eu, us, japan, south korea etc) down, stock markets are recovering a lil bit again after last week....Greece is/was in the ? , nothing noticable happened in europe and the states economy and stock markets wise....China gets in trouble 'unexpectantly' and our markets lost all the profit made since januari 1st...AEX, DAX, Dow Jones etc...
  • kingblaze84
    kingblaze84 Members Posts: 14,288 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Other
    Zero % for Hillary?? Wow.....
  • Ajackson17
    Ajackson17 Members Posts: 22,501 ✭✭✭✭✭
    SneakDZA wrote: »
    5 Grand wrote: »
    Out of all the candidates, Donald Trump seems the most sincere. He doesn't pander like Hillary.

    Hillary is so phony. Her body language looks like somebody told her how to act in front of a camera.

    So you would vote for a virulent racist, sexist , spiteful, petty and vindictive ? because he's sincere about being a virulent racist, sexist , spiteful, petty and vindictive ? ?

    And what makes him more "sincere" than someone like Bernie Sanders who has been pretty consistent in what he says and does his whole career in politics?
    Worked for Bill Clinton though......

    And Bernie is sincerely fragile. Socialism is the worse type of economy for Black people.

    worse then communism??

    A economic system has nothing to do with how people are treated, it's up to the people and the leaders to make sure their people are treated with respect and wealth distribution is distributed correctly.
  • jono
    jono Members Posts: 30,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Demand cant increase if wages keep decreasing or continue to stagnate.
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Other
    The Dutch companies actually do rival and surpass their US counterparts but youre just ignoring Most of my post anyway bro hahaha @zombie

    just like u ignore the numbers in the links u hooked us up with. Combined the European nations are larger economy wise and Eastern Europe has massive economic potential, but it will take a generation before they rival their western and northern european counterparts...Im hoping the US doesnt outsource to much and the lesser states will rise to(in the end were allies anyway)...

    I think the whole world is looking flabby and sick economy wise at the moment, but high unemployment rates of spain and italy, doesnt mean much for Holland and Germany at the moment.

    honestly though, Im mostly worried the Chinese will slow and drag 'us' (eu, us, japan, south korea etc) down, stock markets are recovering a lil bit again after last week....Greece is/was in the ? , nothing noticable happened in europe and the states economy and stock markets wise....China gets in trouble 'unexpectantly' and our markets lost all the profit made since januari 1st...AEX, DAX, Dow Jones etc...

    China ? up actually strengthens the dollar which itself comes with negatives and positive for us. But really you shouldn't compare the effect China has on the global economy to Greece . Greece can disappear and the world economy won't suffer to much from it's loss.

    Those other nations I mentioned however would have a direct and extremely negative impact on European economies if they were to crash economically. The extreme long term weaknesses in Europe is the fact that each nation doesn't control control monetary policy for itself. Most American debt is owned by American agencies therefore there is a lot our federal reserve can do to minimize any ? ups we make.
  • zzombie
    zzombie Members Posts: 11,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Other
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    zzombie wrote: »
    (ob)Scene wrote: »
    Low-Income Workers Have Nowhere Affordable To Live, New Report Shows

    Low-income workers and their families do not earn enough to live in even the least expensive metropolitan American communities, according to a new analysis of families’ living costs published Wednesday.

    The analysis, released by the left-leaning Economic Policy Institute, is an annual update of the think tank’s Family Budget Calculator that reflects new 2014 data. The Family Budget Calculator is a formula designed to determine the income “required for families to attain a secure yet modest standard of living” in 618 different communities across the country that the U.S. Census Bureau defines as metropolitan areas. The formula uses data collected by the government and some nonprofit groups to measure costs of housing, food, child care, transportation, health care, “other necessities” like clothing, and taxes for families of 10 different compositions in these specific locales.

    The updated Family Budget Calculator shows that even the most affordable metropolitan areas in the country are beyond the reach of millions of American families with incomes above the official federal poverty level. The official federal poverty level for a family of two parents and two children in 2014 was $24,008, according to the EPI. But the least expensive metropolitan area in the country for this family type is Morristown, Tennessee, where a family needs an income of $49,114, according to the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator.

    The Economic Policy Institute also estimates that minimum-wage workers -- who almost universally earn less than the federal poverty level -- lack the income needed to make an adequate living in any of the communities surveyed, even if they are single and childless. The think tank notes that this includes minimum-wage workers living in cities or states with a higher minimum wage than the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour, or $15,080 a year for a full-time worker.

    Even families with incomes closer to the middle of the earnings spectrum lack the means to maintain an adequate standard of living. The nation’s median household income was $51,939 in 2013 -- the most recent year in which data were available -- not much higher than the cost of living in the relatively inexpensive Morristown.

    The median household income nationwide is also significantly less than is needed to live in the metropolitan area of Des Moines, Iowa, which is the median in costliness for a family with two parents and two children among the communities included in the Economic Policy Institute’s budget calculator. A family of that makeup in Des Moines requires an income of $63,741 to live adequately.

    In addition, the updated Family Budget Calculator found that Washington, D.C., is the most expensive metropolitan area in the country for a family to raise children. A family with two parents and two children requires $106,493 to maintain an adequate living standard in the D.C. metropolitan area. Following D.C., the most expensive metropolitan areas for a family of the same makeup were Nassau-Suffolk, New York (Long Island); Westchester County, New York; New York City; Stamford-Norwalk, Connecticut; Honolulu; Poughkeepsie-Newburgh-Middletown, New York; Ithaca, New York; San Francisco; and Danbury, Connecticut....

    “Wage growth has been stagnant for most workers for decades and, as a result, there is a mismatch between what workers are paid and what it takes to live and support a family,” said Elise Gould, senior economist at the Economic Policy Institute, in a statement. “We need a variety of policies to boost wage growth, which includes a higher minimum wage, stronger overtime rules, collective bargaining rights, and enforcement of labor standards as well as the pursuit of a full-employment economy.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/low-income-workers-have-nowhere-to-live-new-report-shows_55de2b29e4b029b3f1b17e4c

    Housing cost is a result of mostly SUPPLY AND DEMAND increasing wages without increasing supply will do nothing except maybe drive the cost up nyc is the perfect example of this Here the demand is higher than the supply so housing cost are higher but workers in nyc also make a higher dollar amount for doing the same work people in other areas do for less.

    ? . The majority of workers in NYC did not see their wages rise along with the cost of housing and living in general. Their wages remained largely the same as Bloomberg did all he could to incentivize rich folks to move here in hopes of increasing tax revenue. The result is the gentrification that we see now. Minorities and low income familes got displaced, hipsters/rich white people moved in, Bushwick became East Williamsburg, and the majority are still struggling.

    reading comprehension on you liberals is poor

    I never said the bold i said that workers in nyc make more money for doing the same job that people in other states do. Generally speaking this is across the board for all levels of jobs, a plumber in nyc makes more than one in SOUTH DAKOTA

    THE increased pay of nyc workers has no effect on the housing situation in this city because the supply of housing is less than the demand thus driving prices up.

    How you gonna have the nerve to talk about my comprehension when I gave you a study that specifically addresses the fact that though workers make more in some places the ratios generally remain the same.

    I know you aren't dumb so don't be sitting here trying to tell me your point was that NYers earn more than people from South Dakota as if the difference in cost of living doesn't cancel that out. And in BOTH places the income still isn't sufficient enough.

    The point i was trying to make with the NYC VS DAKOTA thing is that it does not matter how much you raise the income because their are economic forces that will delete any progress you think you are going to make if you artificially inflate wages. This is in regards to housing cost in the economy of nyc

    do you understand what i am trying to show you??? simply raising the wages of all people won't work economies exist on a micro level and an macro level. Bernie sander increasing wages could help the people in dakota attain housing but it will either do nothing for the people in nyc or make their situation worse BECAUSE our supply and demand situation is unique to us.


    That goes directly back to my explanation of low income families being pushed out of the city though. Why do you believe the supply of housing in NY is less than the demand?

    well first of all there is a natural limit on space which limits supply second of all building in nyc is a hard for smaller firms because of soo many regulations with zoning and permits and taxes and extra ? and on top of that there is competition from big and small companies. ULTIMATELY the supply cannot keep up with the demand.

    I was referring to what increased the demand... because this wasn't as big of an issue in NY 15-20 years ago.

    Lower crime and physically cleaning up the city increased demand to live here. when Crime goes down people feel safe and want to live in the city.that set off a chain reaction
  • BigBallsNoWorries
    BigBallsNoWorries Members Posts: 5,461 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ? Bernie Sanders sounds like he can be the truth

    I got to research this ?
  • BigBallsNoWorries
    BigBallsNoWorries Members Posts: 5,461 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Oh damn I thought Bernie was black


    I really want to get behind that ? Ben Carson, support another one of our own


    but for a brain surgeon, this ? says some ignorant ? lol