Iran’s ayatollah: Jihad will last until America is wiped out
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actually, i don't think conservative estimates a) saying 100000+ or b) attribute all that to the US. feel free to provide sourcing but either way we can keep moving.kingblaze84 wrote: »Well OF COURSE Iran did not recently bomb Iraq crazy and ? over 100,000 plus civilians according to conservative estimates, liberal estimates being at 1 million civilians killed due to the war.
first off, you originally responded to my comments in this vein with "You realize Iraq is asking for help from Iran right? If Iraq agrees to Iran going into its territory and doing what it wants to do, then I have no problem with it." granted, this doesn't eliminate the "well, the US should demur if asked" point, but it DOES have something to do with all your "THE US IS OUT OF CONTROL"kingblaze84 wrote: »My point is that Americans have sacrificed enough in Iraq, one trillion dollars and 4500 dead Americans, 30 K wounded, enough already.
second, i think i'm referring more to your usual thesis
uh... did you even read what i posted?kingblaze84 wrote: »LOL at you willing to listen to anything al-Maliki says. He's a horrible leader-
"now i for one would say the US should make help contingent on Maliki not doing the same damn ? that encouraged all this in the first place"
pretty sure that's neither an endorsement of al-Maliki as a leader or "listening to him." -
actually, i don't think conservative estimates a) saying 100000+ or b) attribute all that to the US. feel free to provide sourcing but either way we can keep moving.kingblaze84 wrote: »Well OF COURSE Iran did not recently bomb Iraq crazy and ? over 100,000 plus civilians according to conservative estimates, liberal estimates being at 1 million civilians killed due to the war.
first off, you originally responded to my comments in this vein with "You realize Iraq is asking for help from Iran right? If Iraq agrees to Iran going into its territory and doing what it wants to do, then I have no problem with it." granted, this doesn't eliminate the "well, the US should demur if asked" point, but it DOES have something to do with all your "THE US IS OUT OF CONTROL"kingblaze84 wrote: »My point is that Americans have sacrificed enough in Iraq, one trillion dollars and 4500 dead Americans, 30 K wounded, enough already.
second, i think i'm referring more to your usual thesis
uh... did you even read what i posted?kingblaze84 wrote: »LOL at you willing to listen to anything al-Maliki says. He's a horrible leader-
"now i for one would say the US should make help contingent on Maliki not doing the same damn ? that encouraged all this in the first place"
pretty sure that's neither an endorsement of al-Maliki as a leader or "listening to him."
I think if al-Maliki stays in power, America should let him twist in the wind, no matter what he says or does. He obviously cannot keep the country together, and he has no respect outside of the Shia communities, and even then the support is mild at best. Iran can deal with the headache for all I care, America has sacrificed more then enough (for nothing).
A new poll shows 74% of Americans do not want troops of any kind being sent back to Iraq, I hope the idiots in DC get that message. I do feel bad for the Iraqi people who will have to deal with Shariah law from this point on though. It also sucks a new terror state has been created, but this was all very predictable. America's foreign policy sucks, and until it doesn't, we can expect more of the same. I predict more Taliban like states in multiple countries by the time Obama's term in office ends. -
pretty muchkingblaze84 wrote: »I think if al-Maliki stays in power, America should let him twist in the wind, no matter what he says or does. He obviously cannot keep the country together, and he has no respect outside of the Shia communities, and even then the support is mild at best.
i think part of the issue is that even if he WAS willing to change his ways (he's not), a situation like the current one is the worst time to make those changes. so it's just going to have to work itself out in a ? way for the near future, i imagine.
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the only way to bring order to the middle east is with ruthless war of the old style the world has to have the conviction to ? these people into submission the way the roman empire did to the people it conquered or else every generation it will just be more ? .
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the only way to bring order to the middle east is with ruthless war of the old style the world has to have the conviction to ? these people into submission the way the roman empire did to the people it conquered or else every generation it will just be more ? .
Basically another Saddam Hussein lol.....he kept order in Iraq, although I do not support a lot of what he did, he still killed less people then American presidents have in the last 25 years, not including Bill Clinton
In other words, several Saddam Husseins. -
pretty muchkingblaze84 wrote: »I think if al-Maliki stays in power, America should let him twist in the wind, no matter what he says or does. He obviously cannot keep the country together, and he has no respect outside of the Shia communities, and even then the support is mild at best.
i think part of the issue is that even if he WAS willing to change his ways (he's not), a situation like the current one is the worst time to make those changes. so it's just going to have to work itself out in a ? way for the near future, i imagine.
Yeah definitely. ISIS will have control of 36% of Iraq for a long time, and the Kurds will hold on to their land for some time since Baghdad is too overwhelmed in protecting itself. I predict another Saddam Hussein will pop up there one day, from the Sunni tribes and if we're lucky, he'll be a secular guy, and limits ISIS' dreams of Shariah law in Iraq.
Whoever comes up powerful though, that leader will likely nationalize the nation's oil like Saddam did and then America and others will try to go to some kind of conflict against Iraq again, within 10 years probably. I believe Iraq is the world's 2nd largest exporter of oil, if I'm not mistaken. I hope my doom and gloom outlook is wrong. -
CNN just said America's military has no plans to go after ISIS at this time because there is too much popular support for ISIS and its Sunni allies in the regions it holds....it shows how fused in ISIS has become with the population, it may be time to ask Maliki to step down
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In a sign of how serious the Jihad movement has become against America, even a Shiite cleric, a very powerful man named Nassar Al-Nadei, is openly calling for the killings of the 300 American advisors sent to Iraq by Obama.....remember that ISIS is a Sunni group LOL SMH
http://news.sky.com/story/1286443/iraq-shia-cleric-issues-threat-to-us-forces
By Sky News US Team
A Shia cleric loyal to anti-US cleric Moqtada al Sadr has warned that the 300 US military advisers en route to Iraq will be attacked.
In a sermon from Baghdad's Sadr City district, Nassir al Saedi threatened what he called "the occupier", saying: "We will be ready for you if you are back."
The warning comes after President Barack Obama announced the deployment of US military advisers, made up mostly of special forces.
Their aim is to help the Iraqi government in its fight against the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS), the group of Sunni extremists who have seized cities and towns across northern Iraq.
---This isn't good. I also saw some of the ISIS videos the other day and they are stating that Americans have killed 1.5 million civilians in Iraq. Whether this is right or wrong, the propaganda videos are very powerful. America sending those advisors is definitely uniting the Jihad movement there. -
this is sort of a false theory, as the Romans did a lot of essentially buying off difficulties with what we'd call "foreign aid." not that they couldn't be ruthless, but we shouldn't say that's all they werethe only way to bring order to the middle east is with ruthless war of the old style the world has to have the conviction to ? these people into submission the way the roman empire did to the people it conquered or else every generation it will just be more ? .
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Saudi Arabia and Russia should be the top 2 if i am not mistaken. Iraq's big thing is not export, but proven reserves, IIRCkingblaze84 wrote: »I believe Iraq is the world's 2nd largest exporter of oil, if I'm not mistaken. I hope my doom and gloom outlook is wrong.
you MIGHT be overstating this as the guy is one of Sadr's boys and thus contractually obligated to lose his ? about the USkingblaze84 wrote: »In a sign of how serious the Jihad movement has become against America, even a Shiite cleric, a very powerful man named Nassar Al-Nadei, is openly calling for the killings of the 300 American advisors sent to Iraq by Obama.....remember that ISIS is a Sunni group LOL SMH
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this is sort of a false theory, as the Romans did a lot of essentially buying off difficulties with what we'd call "foreign aid." not that they couldn't be ruthless, but we shouldn't say that's all they werethe only way to bring order to the middle east is with ruthless war of the old style the world has to have the conviction to ? these people into submission the way the roman empire did to the people it conquered or else every generation it will just be more ? .
correct but with a situation like what is going on now in Iraq I think the romans would use brute force and so should we.
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this is sort of a false theory, as the Romans did a lot of essentially buying off difficulties with what we'd call "foreign aid." not that they couldn't be ruthless, but we shouldn't say that's all they werethe only way to bring order to the middle east is with ruthless war of the old style the world has to have the conviction to ? these people into submission the way the roman empire did to the people it conquered or else every generation it will just be more ? .
correct but with a situation like what is going on now in Iraq I think the romans would use brute force and so should we.
We as in America? Noooooooo, that would inflame the situation even more. There's enough horrible propaganda against us, we need the Iraqis to take care of this situation themselves. If anything, I would support proxy wars to contain ISIS if they start plotting against us, but nothing direct with America, brute force hasn't solved the problem. Bush's shock and awe experiment has helped bring us to this moment...... -
Saudi Arabia and Russia should be the top 2 if i am not mistaken. Iraq's big thing is not export, but proven reserves, IIRCkingblaze84 wrote: »I believe Iraq is the world's 2nd largest exporter of oil, if I'm not mistaken. I hope my doom and gloom outlook is wrong.
you MIGHT be overstating this as the guy is one of Sadr's boys and thus contractually obligated to lose his ? about the USkingblaze84 wrote: »In a sign of how serious the Jihad movement has become against America, even a Shiite cleric, a very powerful man named Nassar Al-Nadei, is openly calling for the killings of the 300 American advisors sent to Iraq by Obama.....remember that ISIS is a Sunni group LOL SMH
I could be overstating the problem with Nadei, but as one of Sadr's boys, he still has a ton of leverage with the Shiites of Iraq. Shiites make up the majority of Iraq, so this could be a serious problem down the line, and it's one of many reasons why America maybe should stay out of this battle, at least for now. It seems there are no reliable people in this fight, no real allies or worthy ones. And to really take the fight to ISIS means going into Syria, which of course isn't a good idea lol -
honestly, i think it depends on if you think the carrot has already been tried or not. it's certainly likely they'd be all about a brutal response at this point... but then, that doesn't mean it'll workcorrect but with a situation like what is going on now in Iraq I think the romans would use brute force and so should we.
oh, i don't disagree it's not an issue, just that i don't think there's any way a Sadr-affiliated guy DOESN'T talk reckless about the USkingblaze84 wrote: »I could be overstating the problem with Nadei, but as one of Sadr's boys, he still has a ton of leverage with the Shiites of Iraq.
