What is it that made Pac a lyricist?

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  • 1of1
    1of1 Members Posts: 37,468 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    lol they aren't, lyricism is an umbrella term and wordplay falls under that...

    Says who? You? Are we ignoring the dictionary now?

    Wordplay = verbal wit
    Lyricism = an intense outpouring of exuberant emotion; a song-like outpouring of a poets thoughts and feelings; expressing direct and usu. intense personal emotion
  • Aztec_Kang
    Aztec_Kang Members Posts: 1,994 ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Punisher__ wrote: »
    . So all this isn't really necessary.

    .

    jump off a cliff ?
  • weezyfgarbage
    weezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited May 2010
    Says who? You? Are we ignoring the dictionary now?

    Wordplay = verbal wit
    Lyricism = an intense outpouring of exuberant emotion; a song-like outpouring of a poets thoughts and feelings; expressing direct and usu. intense personal emotion

    Says the consensus. Intense personal emotion is an intangible.
  • Punisher__
    Punisher__ Members Posts: 3,031 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Lyricism and wordplay are obviously not mutually exclusive, but clearly they're different.

    So by technical definition, Pac is a lyricist. But his wordplay, which is neither here nor there, would be an entirely different subject altogether.
  • judahxulu
    judahxulu Members Posts: 3,988 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Emotion.
    Charisma.
    Simple yet profund wisdom sprinkled in.
    Damn near EVERY classical poetic evice in the book.
    His meter was impeccable
  • 1of1
    1of1 Members Posts: 37,468 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Says the consensus. Intense personal emotion is an intangible.

    So, basically you're saying the true definition of a word doesn't matter if enough people misuse it. OK. This is not about being right or wrong, so we'll agree to disagree.

    Pun is correct with post #30.

    Why is Aztek mad, did I miss something?
  • rip.dilla
    rip.dilla Members Posts: 17,412 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    LOL at the 'big' words used on this thread...
  • south4life
    south4life Members Posts: 9,113 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    @mostvigorousone

    That's what I been trying to tell people for years, Pac was a poetic, emotional rapper.
    They say that to be a lyricist u have to be able to have a 16 with punchlines all thru it and that is not true.
    Pac was a lyricist, he just wasn't what people called a traditional lyricist like Rakim or B.I.G..
    B.I.G. was more of a punchline rapper while Pac was a emotional rapper.
    Pac knew how to get to the emotions of his fans, he knew how to let u feel like he was talking to u.
    B.I.G. was imaginary to me, when I say that, I never lived the live he raps about so it was something I imagined.
    With Pac's music, I could identify with him more than B.I.G. because, we had similar situations.
    Like u said the definition of Lyricism is, that is what Pac was and is still to this day.
    That is why I see him as Top 5 because he was one of the most intense artists in Hip Hop or even Music for that matter.
  • Mvpbrodie93
    Mvpbrodie93 Members Posts: 8,036 ✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Got my min made up-
    So mandatory my elevation my lyrics like orientation
    So you can be more familiar with the ? you facing
    We must be patient nothing better than communication
    Known to damage and highly flamable like gas stations
    Sorry I left that ass waiting
    No more procrastination give up to fate, and get that ass shaking
    I'm busting and making ? panic
    Don't take your life for granted put that ass in the dirt
    You swear the ? was planted
    My lyrics motivate the planet
    It's similar to Rhythm Nation
    but thugged out, forgive me Janet
    Who's in control I'm activating your souls
    You know, the way the games get controlled
    you, two years ago, a friend of mine
    Told me Alize and Cristal blows your mind
    Bear witness to the dopest ? rhyme I wrote
    Taking off my coat, clearing my throat
  • weezyfgarbage
    weezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited May 2010
    So, basically you're saying the true definition of a word doesn't matter if enough people misuse it. OK. This is not about being right or wrong, so we'll agree to disagree.

    Pun is correct with post #30.

    Why is Aztek mad, did I miss something?

    wow this concept is really hard for you to get huh...
  • Punisher__
    Punisher__ Members Posts: 3,031 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Oh. Someone in this thread is not getting something. I won't say who, though. LOL

    By technical definition, lyricism and wordplay are two different facets of emceeing. That's the point I think is trying to be made here. Emceeing is the umbrella term...lyricism and wordplay are the sub-categories.
  • weezyfgarbage
    weezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited May 2010
    Punisher__ wrote: »
    Oh. Someone in this thread is not getting something. I won't say who, though. LOL

    By technical definition, lyricism and wordplay are two different facets of emceeing. That's the point I think is trying to be made here. Emceeing is the umbrella term...lyricism and wordplay are the sub-categories.

    wordplay is still a part of your lyrics. Therefore it's a part of lyricism. It may not be factored heavily into the big picture of lyricism, but it's not something different either.
  • Aztec_Kang
    Aztec_Kang Members Posts: 1,994 ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Why is Aztek mad, did I miss something?

    it's the smart dumb fools that irritate me. There prolly have been 1 million different threads on the reason trying to downplay Tupac's significance.

    This is another one of those threads. If you really read what this thread topic is and think about it's just a blatantly stupid or obvious question.
    Then i gave my answer in the first page and the ? thread starter is just trying to ask the same question in different ways. This type of thread is mad redundant and goes around in circles. Usually these threads are focused on Pac's flow.
  • weezyfgarbage
    weezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited May 2010
    significance doesnt always have to equal skill...pac is like jeter...he's larger than life.
  • Punisher__
    Punisher__ Members Posts: 3,031 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    wordplay is still a part of your lyrics. Therefore it's a part of lyricism. It may not be factored heavily into the big picture of lyricism, but it's not something different either.

    These are made-up definitions of what lyricism and wordplay are, though. Technically, lyricism is not about the words; it's how you PORTRAY those words, i.e execution. Being complex with words, i.e, wordplay, has nothing to do with how you execute it. Sometimes the most profound things are said in the simplest ways. But that doesn't mean you're not a lyricist because, by technical definition, lyricism has nothing to do with complexity. One is the emotive aspect of emceeing; the other is the technical aspect of it.

    Do they go hand in hand? Yes. Because the best emcees are those who are able to combine both of these aspects.
  • Aztec_Kang
    Aztec_Kang Members Posts: 1,994 ✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Punisher__ wrote: »
    These are made-up definitions of what lyricism and wordplay are, though. Technically, lyricism is not about the words; it's how you PORTRAY those words, i.e execution..

    are you all reading this same ? im reading. this dude is saying nothing. wtf?? im out this thread.
  • Punisher__
    Punisher__ Members Posts: 3,031 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    So, basically you're saying the true definition of a word doesn't matter if enough people misuse it. OK. This is not about being right or wrong, so we'll agree to disagree.

    Pun is correct with post #30.

    Why is Aztek mad, did I miss something?

    Clearly, he/she can't comprehend. Because from what I've been seeing in this thread so far, people are agreeing with his/her points.

    There seriously needs to be an IQ test before people are allowed to post on this site.
  • weezyfgarbage
    weezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited May 2010
    Punisher__ wrote: »
    These are made-up definitions of what lyricism and wordplay are, though. Technically, lyricism is not about the words; it's how you PORTRAY those words, i.e execution. Being complex with words, i.e, wordplay, has nothing to do with how you execute it. Sometimes the most profound things are said in the simplest ways. But that doesn't mean you're not a lyricist because, by technical definition, lyricism has nothing to do with complexity. One is the emotive aspect of emceeing; the other is the technical aspect of it.

    Do they go hand in hand? Yes. Because the best emcees are those who are able to combine both of these aspects.

    So you're saying wordplay has nothing to do with how you portray words?
  • Punisher__
    Punisher__ Members Posts: 3,031 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    So you're saying wordplay has nothing to do with how you portray words?

    Did you not see the definitions that were posted?

    Wordplay is verbal wit...using literary techniques would fall under THIS umbrella, because it's the technical aspect of emceeing. Lyricism has nothing to do with being technical, because it's a different facet altogether.
  • Punisher__
    Punisher__ Members Posts: 3,031 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    You can say that Pac's wordplay was not that great, or it lacked complexity. But in hindsight, he's still a lyricist because he fits the definition of what lyricism is, which is not dependent upon wordplay or verbal complexity.
  • isayas
    isayas Confirm Email Posts: 2,972 ✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Punisher__ wrote: »
    You can say that Pac's wordplay was not that great, or it lacked complexity. But in hindsight, he's still a lyricist because he fits the definition of what lyricism is, which is not dependent upon wordplay or verbal complexity.

    Exactly, hip hop listeners will never understand.
  • weezyfgarbage
    weezyfgarbage Members Posts: 1,673
    edited May 2010
    Punisher__ wrote: »
    Did you not see the definitions that were posted?

    Wordplay is verbal wit...using literary techniques would fall under THIS umbrella, because it's the technical aspect of emceeing. Lyricism has nothing to do with being technical, because it's a different facet altogether.

    Sounds more like splitting hairs...I guess I'm guilty of doing that too.
  • JokerzWyld
    JokerzWyld Members Posts: 5,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2010
    Aztec_Kang wrote: »
    Tupac used many poetic techniques in his rhymes like alliteration, personification, metaphors, similies, vertical rythm, assonance, consonance, hyperbole, etc. etc.

    Tupac was a very poetic rapper.

    there's a community on the internet who seem to only value the merit of multi-syllable rhymes and these people hate tupac with a vengeance.(it's very odd)

    Tupac also used multi sylablle rhymes just not as much as some other artists.

    if you count the meter of Pac's rhymes most happen to be iambic pentameter. if that ain't poetic i don't know what is.

    ^^^^^I agree with this