Ain't This About a ? , Dominicans Are Out Here Lynching Haitians
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Martinique and Guadeloupe had revolts too, but they were put down
I think pretty much all Caribbean slave nations had rebellions in some form -
i meant soon after the Haitian Revolution
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Yeah, a shame it didn't work out. I've always wanted to know why tropical disease helped ? off the 50,000 troops Napoleon sent over to Haiti, but the troops he sent into his other colonies in the Caribbean didn't suffer from the same fate.
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Where's Paul Hate when you need him?
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Paul H still posts here? Haven't seen that idiot in a long time
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where is ? Saladinkingblaze84 wrote: »As far as pure power and wide spread influence, I always considered Napoleon possibly a top 3 general but maybe he's top 4 when I think about it
1) Genghis Khan
2) Alexander the Great
3) Julius Caesar
4) Napoleon
also i would submit that Wellington earned the right to declare his superiority over Napoleon
obviously there's multiple reasons why France failed to control the colony; it's only a note that France couldn't bring its full weight to bear. you could probably say the same thing about other revolutions; it's not specific to Haiti.kingblaze84 wrote: »And you're right in that France was overstretched, but Napoleon still sent a large force into Haiti to put down the slave rebellion, capture Haiti for France and re-instate slavery. And he STILL lost. Napoleon also admitted to his followers that the French could not handle the tropical diseases the way the Haitians could. -
Personal view on visiting the DR:
This situation gets to me between Haiti and the DR. I have visited the DR 4 times and planned on moving there, but the racism that is there is constantly on my mind. The majority of Dominicans look pretty much like an Al Horford from the Atlanta Hawks. You don't see the majority looking like Rocsi Diaz or Selma Hayek (I know they ain't from the DR). I say that to say, they are mixed with black and don't deny it. But, however, they will and do consider themselves white and will say it. This constantly was like a sad comedy when I was there. To stay on point to the Haitians, they have a special hate for the Haitian due to what y'all stated along with just self-hatred racism. To this also, being a black American who lies when he goes there and says I'm from Canada they do not push that same hate onto other blacks.
The racism over there seemed to be less racist than America if I had to weigh the two against each other. Blending in was easy as hell, cause like I said most of them are just light brown and brown (the majority are not dark or very white looking latinos) and until you talk they don't know where you are from and assume you are Dominican.
I often liked to go to the clubs and on their campuses and be inconspicuous and just sit to watch how they treated each other, and they were kind to each other. I could see where the very dark women seemed to have a harder time than most, but for the guys that were dark and Dominican it appeared they were okay if they were Dominican. They were all friendly to each other and not only the tourists; and where I was sometimes there weren't no tourists.
But, then I had a friend from there who lives in America now who told me the American Dominicans are more racist than the native Dominicans and that what they want to be is white. He also stated the Dominicans are racist and he was a light skin black dude about TI the rapper's skin tone. He said it was because he would not texturize his hair that he wasn't completely accepted; and they don't want to show their nappy hair (thus all the hair salons they have in the US) and the men and women texturize if their hair isnt curly straight enough naturally.
But then when I go there and people hear me talk they point to their skin and point to me and say we are the same. They'll even point out our last names are similar. I see so many brown people it's almost impossible to imagine that place being racist. It is. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just saying that just imagine someone putting you in Nigeria and someone says to you "you know Nigerians are racist against each other." That's how many brown people you see. It's a hell of a lot and visually they look to be mixing until you go to richer spots and it becomes obvious that the skin tone just got a lot lighter.
I know everyone will say my experience; it's because I'm American or an american lying saying they're from canada and considered rich......but I gotta say it just didn't feel that way. I went to Cayman Islands and didn't get that same love and went to Aruba and didn't get that same love, went to Costa Rica and didn't get that same and Panama was straight up racist; so I have to put the DR in perspective and say they're less racist than the countries I just named including America.
Hell,Maybe I was struck by all the ? and fell in love to a lie -
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Yeah, rico that's typically what 70% of the dominicans look like, the other 30 are a little darker or lighter
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kingblaze84 wrote: »
might be overrating that little Corsican a little.kingblaze84 wrote: »Yeah you make sense, Haiti had its hands full dealing with Napoleon, one of the top 3 generals of all time probably. And France still had lots of troops in North America and the Caribbean, so with America being friends with France too, Haitians realistically couldn't do much outside the island.
Haiti's revolution did hit at a time when France was a little overstretched, so it's probably less about what France could do and more about "surrounding nations weren't anti-slavery enough."
As far as pure power and wide spread influence, I always considered Napoleon possibly a top 3 general but maybe he's top 4 when I think about it
1) Genghis Khan
2) Alexander the Great
3) Julius Caesar
4) Napoleon
And you're right in that France was overstretched, but Napoleon still sent a large force into Haiti to put down the slave rebellion, capture Haiti for France and re-instate slavery. And he STILL lost. Napoleon also admitted to his followers that the French could not handle the tropical diseases the way the Haitians could.
You forget Hannibal and Nzhinga from Africa. They were great generals Hannibal nearly sacked Rome and Nzhinga defeated the Portuguese and Dutch well into her 80s -
Focal Point wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »
might be overrating that little Corsican a little.kingblaze84 wrote: »Yeah you make sense, Haiti had its hands full dealing with Napoleon, one of the top 3 generals of all time probably. And France still had lots of troops in North America and the Caribbean, so with America being friends with France too, Haitians realistically couldn't do much outside the island.
Haiti's revolution did hit at a time when France was a little overstretched, so it's probably less about what France could do and more about "surrounding nations weren't anti-slavery enough."
As far as pure power and wide spread influence, I always considered Napoleon possibly a top 3 general but maybe he's top 4 when I think about it
1) Genghis Khan
2) Alexander the Great
3) Julius Caesar
4) Napoleon
And you're right in that France was overstretched, but Napoleon still sent a large force into Haiti to put down the slave rebellion, capture Haiti for France and re-instate slavery. And he STILL lost. Napoleon also admitted to his followers that the French could not handle the tropical diseases the way the Haitians could.
You forget Hannibal and Nzhinga from Africa. They were great generals Hannibal nearly sacked Rome and Nzhinga defeated the Portuguese and Dutch well into her 80s
Those were great generals for sure, Hannibal was a beast but Genghis Khan helped create the largest continuous land empire in history, to this day. The Mongolian Empire went as far as big parts of Russia and Hungary. Alexander the Great never lost a battle and conquered most of the known world for his time. Hannibal is in my top 10 list of generals.
I gotta do more research on Nzhinga, she did a great job fighting off the Portuguese but my list has people who very rarely lost battles, while Nzhinga sadly lost quite a bit. She's one of the best female warriors I've ever read about though. -
I went to Cayman Islands and didn't get that same love and went to Aruba and didn't get that same love, went to Costa Rica and didn't get that same and Panama was straight up racist; so I have to put the DR in perspective and say they're less racist than the countries I just named including America.
@luke1733
could you compare your experiences in those countries to DR? i'm a bit surprised at the nations you named (namely Cayman and Aruba) -
Hannibal gets kind of overlooked because he ultimately lost completely but Nzinga is probably not top 5. i mean... who CAN'T defeat the Portuguese?Focal Point wrote: »You forget Hannibal and Nzhinga from Africa. They were great generals Hannibal nearly sacked Rome and Nzhinga defeated the Portuguese and Dutch well into her 80s
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kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »If they keep this up there's gonna be serious riots in DR...Haitians don't play
With that being said, Caribbeans shouldn't be looking down on Haitians, assuming that's true. While other Caribbean peoples were being ? on, whipped and enslaved for generations and got freedom only due to White mercy, Haitians fought and killed for their freedom in 1804, the way real ? is supposed to. Black Haitians got their freedom even before Blacks in America got it. No Caribbean should have the nerve to look down on any Haitian.
false, there were other rebellions throughout the Caribbean; yall just were the most successful one
There were other rebellions but none overthew the slave system in the Caribbean. At best some slaves ran away and formed their own communities. But majorities were still enslaved.
Haiti technically didn't overthrow the French
Only way a country can make you pay them back the way the French did is if they have superior military might. The Haitians won a battle, and rather than go in and murk the whole Island France decided to make them financial slaves rather than physical ones.
So sure, they won a battle for their physical freedom, only to get economically ? . -
kingblaze84 wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »If they keep this up there's gonna be serious riots in DR...Haitians don't play
With that being said, Caribbeans shouldn't be looking down on Haitians, assuming that's true. While other Caribbean peoples were being ? on, whipped and enslaved for generations and got freedom only due to White mercy, Haitians fought and killed for their freedom in 1804, the way real ? is supposed to. Black Haitians got their freedom even before Blacks in America got it. No Caribbean should have the nerve to look down on any Haitian.
false, there were other rebellions throughout the Caribbean; yall just were the most successful one
There were other rebellions but none overthew the slave system in the Caribbean. At best some slaves ran away and formed their own communities. But majorities were still enslaved.
Haiti technically didn't overthrow the French
Only way a country can make you pay them back the way the French did is if they have superior military might. The Haitians won a battle, and rather than go in and murk the whole Island France decided to make them financial slaves rather than physical ones.
So sure, they won a battle for their physical freedom, only to get economically ? .
I think it's better to be physically free, but I see your point. France did have a global empire and about 300,000 troops worldwide at the time?? So they were able to scare the Haitians into making those compensation payments that definitely held back Haiti. But Haiti still overthrew the French I'd say, Napoleon lost 50,000 troops in the last few battles, he could have sent more troops but he knew the Haitians were too motivated. And the Haitians were kicking the French's ass almost nonstop in the last few years leading to 1804. Haitians at one point killed like 97% of all the French on the island, that's Django Unchained times a thousand lol.
Haiti I think was just too tired from war to fight the debt payments and didn't want to risk another long siege from the French. It was bad enough they were isolated from the world. -
also the president of Haiti wanted Euro/American recognition smh
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Aggy F
@luke1733I went to Cayman Islands and didn't get that same love and went to Aruba and didn't get that same love, went to Costa Rica and didn't get that same and Panama was straight up racist; so I have to put the DR in perspective and say they're less racist than the countries I just named including America.
could you compare your experiences in those countries to DR? i'm a bit surprised at the nations you named (namely Cayman and Aruba)
This is some of the stuff without writing a book:
1.In Panama went to 3 restaurants on different days. One was TGIF and I went with a friend of mine's aunt who is a native and lives there. We waited at the table for 45 minutes and were not served or asked if we wanted water. She pointed out it was racism and complained to the manager. We left.
Another time on the main strip, I walked in and sat at the bar, the only one in the restaurant, the bar tender walked out from the back and saw me, walked to the far side of the bar and then walked away and would not come back. When I walked outside I saw him and he saw me and he turned away to walk away again back into the store but into the back. Went to another restaurant in Panama, in a very nice hotel were everyone was dressing up and sat down to get some food. After all the obvious racist mean looking curious stares, the first server would not serve me. Without me saying anything and after waiting 20minutes another server automatically apologized and began serving me; stating he didn't know why I had not been served and apologized again. It was obvious when I arrived that everyone knew I was there b/c they kept staring but refused to acknowledge me when it came to service.
Costa Rica, the natives seemed pretty cool and unbelievably genuine.
2. Went to a beach in Panama and 3 native panamanians (very light) and one white guy were sitting at a table.
When I walked in they said "another ? , I don't like them." I understand the spanish he spoke. I asked my taxi driver who was showing me where to go if I was correct in translation and he said I was right. I walked up to them and called them "honkeys and pieces of ? ," and something else to fight but they pretended they didn't know what I was saying and the taxi driver told me to ignore it and let it go.
3.The Colombians that were there were different. In Panama and Jaco,Costa Rica you will find almost as many colombians as natives and visually it's hard to know the difference. This girl came to me at the bar and began talking to me, bought me a beer and said she wanted to leave and ? . I said great, we left and ? . Not to my surprise babe was a prostitute street walker. Didn't know that night b/c I had just come into town; later when my hotel receptionist saw me with her she was disgusted and shamed me because she and I were to hang out and once she saw me with that girl she wouldn't touch me.
Come to find out later the street walker also had a bad reputation (say that cause in other countries alot of prostitutes are NOT ostracized like in the US and considered no different than alot of other women) and wanted to use me so she could seem normal. So as we went clubbing the next day and I paid for her to go clubbing, got her drinks and she showed me around town the second day when she was high on coke she started calling me ? at the bar. She was mad b/c she had to pay for us to eat, she paid for our drinks, and paid for something else and I'd started to refuse to pay and told her to leave. As I was getting up to leave, she apologized and said how she was surprised I was offended and started spilling her life story to me. I left her and she came stalking me the rest of my vacation everywhere I went.....even waiting at my hotel room door for I don't know how many hours until I came back 2 days in a row.
4. Also in Jaco went to different club and the bar tender wrote on napkin ? (I know spanish) and I saw what she wrote and had left at the far end of the bar when she'd left (didn't think I would see it)and wasn't serving me and then left.
5. Jaco they have this setup where they pull right behind you as you're backing up and want you to hit them. I did and had to pay the guy $200 to keep from telling the police I hit him while intoxicated. It was easier than going to jail, but it was a scam locals run and are in with the police on it.
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6. Jaco I hung out with some white guys who one of them had a house there and had 6 of his friends who were running some internet poker scam down there and another was like a big time fisherman. I went out with them to a couple of clubs (jaco's pretty small, about 8 clubs in a 1 mile radius and that's it besides the beach) and the police stopped us as we were walking to the clubs and searched all our pockets. The white guys said that'd never happened to them before in life and were mad and blamed me for being the reason they were stopped b/c a black draws cops attention they said. They had to pay the cops to keep from being arrested b/c they had marijuana on them.
7. Panama trying to get a flight out and they want to give up my seat on the airplane for other white passengers and tried to convince me to take another flight. When I refused they acted like they misunderstood my spanish and english (which they do speak english in airports) and continued to give up my seat anyway. I called my priceline, I went to the manager, I went to the desk and demanded I get put on the plane and they finally let me on.
8. In Panama at the hotel, and I'm with a group called Caravan where we'd tour the entire country and stay in hotels. Well, my tour guide put me in touch with the front desk security guard to show me around town. I'd already hooked up with the bar tender girl, but she spoke of how we couldn't hang out and be seen leaving the hotel together or else she'd get fired. So, later I wanted to go hollar at some other girls and the security guard took me around. After 3 days tripping out I walk up to the desk where he is and he's with 2 other hotel workers. "My ? . What's up my ? ?" This guy is probably a hair lighter than me and it's ridiculous. The other co-workers started smiling as he held up his hand for dep. I told him "man, you a ? . I don't say that. You're the same exact color as me. In America and the rest of the world we're brothers and you're a ? ." I rolled up my sleeve and put my arm next to his and said same color.
He looked hurt when I said that and the rest of the hotel clerks shut up.
9. While in Aruba, the locals who are just black. They're not even stereotypical mixed latino looking. They were telling me the stories about the racism and how the island was divided in two with whites, tourists and foreigners on one side and the blacks on the other. Aruba was somewhat cool, it's just the women weren't that open to foreigners at all. There were soooooo many people from Europe and other countries there that their snooty attitudes and harsh looks to me are what made me feel the racism. I can't say the natives of Aruba were the ones responsible for the racism.
10. Cayman Islands I didn't experience racism there. Got tired and felt weird when people would say I'm not black and that I was mixed with something. I guess that's how mixed people or some latinos feel when we tell them they're black. In the Cayman blacks seemed to be doing financially very well, especially compared to Dominican and Panama.
In the Dominican the police will constantly mess with you. They just will and they're dangerous. Had an Ak-47 to my head and the other police held a 9 because they accused me of not stopping at a stop sign of which I did stop. They took my passport and wanted to arrest me and wanted me to get out the car but I told them "No, keep my passport, Iam going to the US embassy down the street officer and you can follow me there and we can get everything straight." I thank ? for allowing me to think of that with guns to my head, b/c I'm not a quick thinker; but somehow in that instance I said the right thing b/c they gave me my passport back and told me to go.
Overall, Costa Rica and Dominican are the only 2 countries I went to where people were friendly and would acknowledge you and reach out to speak to you and hold a conversation with you without knowing you. The look on their faces just looks peaceful and at rest and easy going.
Panama is basically New York City. It's filled with skyscrapers, people with crooked looks that DON"T LIKE AMERICANS and don't like blacks. Aruba was just separated between natives vs white natives and foreigners.
Each country I spoke of to explain for you Aggy what happened, it ain't like I didn't meet alot of cool people. There were a lot of good genuine and extra nice folk in each country. You ain't ask for those experiences so I put what you asked
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thanks for sharing, i was most interested in 1) what was the Spanish word they used for "? " because if i am correct, there are differing perjoratives used in different nations and 2) i'm half Aruban (mother) so i was interested in your experience in Aruba because I have personally never seen/experienced racism in Aruba (i know it exists obviously). the two sides of the island you are talking about are Oranjestad/Noord (where most of the population (which is "white"/"mixed" and tourists are) and San Nicolaas (where a lot of black immigrants (Anglophone/DR/Colombian) are). Arubans are both very friendly and xenophobic
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cool, man. ain't no problemthanks for sharing, i was most interested in 1) what was the Spanish word they used for "? " because if i am correct, there are differing perjoratives used in different nations and 2) i'm half Aruban (mother) so i was interested in your experience in Aruba because I have personally never seen/experienced racism in Aruba (i know it exists obviously). the two sides of the island you are talking about are Oranjestad/Noord (where most of the population (which is "white"/"mixed" and tourists are) and San Nicolaas (where a lot of black immigrants (Anglophone/DR/Colombian) are). Arubans are both very friendly and xenophobic
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white supremacy is world wide.
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I am never going to visit DR unless they change their policy on the treatment of Haitian and Dominicans with Haitian descent. I am not with a clear comscience will spend money on a nation that is oppressing my people. Not happening. I will rather visit Colombia,PR,Venezuela or Panama.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxI1BBTQqfE
