Cuba removed from U.S. terrorism list
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going to point out that this is the actual quote: "Saudi Arabia might not even be as corrupt and abusive as Venezuela." "better" is something else.lol at Saudi being better than Venezuela. i'm done.
Venezuela is pretty ? up right now. it's not a status that requires an embrace of Islamic fundamentalism. -
this post epitomizes American hypocrisy.
Well I'm sorry you feel that way. Especially being that America totes itself as a beacon of democracy and justice worldwide (until democracy and justice is inconvenient)
is it financing mass murder globally or financing governments that have committed mass murder?And yes a person who's government has financed mass murders globally does not have the moral authority to chastise the Cuban government without first denouncing their own government.
also, i don't think i said it was appropriate for the US to do that, so i suppose there's that as well?
Ummmm yeah it's definitely financing mass murder globally. If we pay money... to autocratic regimes…to help them maintain power…and one of the ways they maintain power is through mass murder …then we financed mass murder. You think America should get a pass because we don't send checks to dictators that say "Mass Murder Money" in the memo line?
And no, you didn't explicitly say that it was appropriate for America to do that…but when you say things like " Cuba have this weird fandom where a guy like Castro can literally reign as a dictator for decades and be seen as a force of righteous freedom" I find it ironic…when you have a government in America that goes from nation to nation installing autocrats, paying for mass murders to be done to protect its interests and policies that oppress its own minorities…all while maintaining sizable fandom. The man in your avi said it best, "American democracy is hypocrisy".
except that when you add in "government forces" not actually controlled by the government, it starts to look like we're doing what we can to fudge the numbers. ADDITIONALLY, there's obviously a distinction between "government has prisoners shot" and "police office in X state shot someone under questionable circumstances" that i think is being skipped over here.Correct, police shootings are largely not federal…but I'm comparing the killing of citizens by government forces in the U.S to killing of citizens to government forces in Cuba.
But we already established that Cuba doesn't have a federalist style of government like the U.S. does…it has a unitary state. That being the case it's not an accurate comparison to line up Castro's regime with just the Federal Government of the United States when in the case of Cuba, Castro's regime also plays the role that state/county/local governments do here. The state/county/local governments in the US are all subordinate to the federal government.
I'm comparing killings of United States citizens by government in the United States (as opposed to the United States Government) to killings by government in Cuba. Stop looking for arbitrary technicalities (nice try though).
And yes of course there are distinctions but I don't think either one is better than the other..we have two scenarios where the government is killing its citizens…both without trial. Sure you can say "oh it's not the exact same situation as in Cuba so it's automatically not as bad" but in actuality very few developed countries (if any) kills it's citizens at the same rate the United States does. (and NO other country in the world incarcerates it's citizens at the rate the US does…not even Cuba)
And as far as comparisons being raw numbers vs per capita…I can only guess. United States doesn't keep records of the people that are killed by police just like it's unlikely for me to find accurate numbers on how many people Castro has killed.
Lol you would argue that now wouldn't you. -
going to point out that this is the actual quote: "Saudi Arabia might not even be as corrupt and abusive as Venezuela." "better" is something else.lol at Saudi being better than Venezuela. i'm done.
Venezuela is pretty ? up right now. it's not a status that requires an embrace of Islamic fundamentalism.
Venezuela is ? up, they are running out of many basic supplies (for American standards) but the Saudis do have the more abusive govt, how many corrupt wars worldwide is Venezuela fighting? How many hospitals and schools is Venezuela blowing up?
Does Venezuela's govt behead people for not being Muslim anymore, and even prevent women from driving? I'd say Saudi Arabia is way more abusive to people worldwide compared to Venezuela's govt. Venezuela's govt might be a little more corrupt though, haven't heard of the Saudis running out of tissue or paper towels -
at some point, repeated bold declarations of someone else's hypocrisy are simply one's own hypocrisy.this post epitomizes American hypocrisy.
are you going to tell me with a straight face that a country like Cuba DOESN'T tout themselves as a beacon of (insert positive values here)? because this is a thing that every country does.Well I'm sorry you feel that way. Especially being that America totes itself as a beacon of democracy and justice worldwide (until democracy and justice is inconvenient)
i think we should bash America for supporting dictators and not give Cuba a pass either. is that hard to do?You think America should get a pass because we don't send checks to dictators that say "Mass Murder Money" in the memo line?
and yet, here's the thing: if we come into this thread and criticize American policies for whatever reason, that's cool. and it should be. but if we criticize Cuba, how dare we exhibit American hypocrisy, because Cuba ... uh ... well, we're not going to be defending Cuba here for some reason.And no, you didn't explicitly say that it was appropriate for America to do that…but when you say things like " Cuba have this weird fandom where a guy like Castro can literally reign as a dictator for decades and be seen as a force of righteous freedom" I find it ironic…when you have a government in America that goes from nation to nation installing autocrats, paying for mass murders to be done to protect its interests and policies that oppress its own minorities…all while maintaining sizable fandom.
you want to talk about hypocrisy? giving a country like Cuba a pass for anything bad it does because America has also done bad things is the most common kind of hypocrisy found on this forum. and i am still going to point out that if you think the US president or Congress sucks, you can at least vote against them and see them leave office in this country. it IS a little easier to take your "beacon of freedom" stance when your country isn't run by one of those murderous autocrats.
i know, i know, it's very difficult to debate a topic without making it personal.I'm comparing killings of United States citizens by government in the United States (as opposed to the United States Government) to killings by government in Cuba. Stop looking for arbitrary technicalities (nice try though).
the distinction i'm making is that a local jurisdiction in the US can have policies that result in a police officer killing someone that are not directed by the federal government. per your breakdown, that doesn't happen in Cuba because the equivalent is part and parcel of the federal government and thus directed by it. further, if we're talking about rounding up and executing prisoners, this is actually different than police officers shooting people because of some ? law or their own personal issues.
sorry, that's "arbitrary technicalities," i think.And yes of course there are distinctions-
fine, don't say "the US is better than Cuba." but this is not an argument that says Cuba can't be criticized.-but I don't think either one is better than the other..we have two scenarios where the government is killing its citizens…both without trial. Sure you can say "oh it's not the exact same situation as in Cuba so it's automatically not as bad" but in actuality very few developed countries (if any) kills it's citizens at the same rate the United States does.
also, the "developed countries" theory starts this slippery slope where someone names a country and someone else has to argue why that country is not "developed." so you might want to define what that means before someone starts telling me why Mexico and Russia aren't developed nations (completely separate debate, but one that got weird in that regard).
i don't know exactly what this means, because your statement was "It's a slower drip which gives comparable numbers," which implies, whatever the figures, you have SOME basis for the claim, right? so is the basis raw numbers of people killed? or a per capita thing? or literally just a feeling?And as far as comparisons being raw numbers vs per capita…I can only guess.
right, i would, but i would also be more interested in debating the topic than the people making it. so there's that as well.Lol you would argue that now wouldn't you. -
well, SA is fighting, what, one war and Venezuela is fighting zero and i'm sitting here saying "does either of those numbers mean they do or don't abuse their OWN population?kingblaze84 wrote: »Venezuela is ? up, they are running out of many basic supplies (for American standards) but the Saudis do have the more abusive govt, how many corrupt wars worldwide is Venezuela fighting? How many hospitals and schools is Venezuela blowing up?
no, Venezuela's government just cosigns street gangs killing you for not agreeing with its politics. it's possible each country can be ? in its OWN WAY.kingblaze84 wrote: »Does Venezuela's govt behead people for not being Muslim anymore, and even prevent women from driving?
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Lol this is one of those things that sounds good but actually make no sense.
ironically, this points out that in the US, we actually elect presidents instead of having decades of dictatorshipbig up the castros, there shower, 50 years on & still standing, how many devil presidents of the US goverment have come & gone
but big up the Castros for 56 years of not giving a ? about the rights of Cubans!
^^^^ Your first post in this thread.
How are you quick to condemn the Castros for 56 years of "not giving a ? about the rights of Cubans!" but also quick to defend America for 300+ years for not giving a ? about the rights of its minorities?
This is the sentiment that you keep trying to deflect from. I'm not interesting in hearing any American denounce the human rights records of Cuba until they denounce the human rights record of their own nation first. Anything less would be…..hypocritical.
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well, SA is fighting, what, one war and Venezuela is fighting zero and i'm sitting here saying "does either of those numbers mean they do or don't abuse their OWN population?kingblaze84 wrote: »Venezuela is ? up, they are running out of many basic supplies (for American standards) but the Saudis do have the more abusive govt, how many corrupt wars worldwide is Venezuela fighting? How many hospitals and schools is Venezuela blowing up?
no, Venezuela's government just cosigns street gangs killing you for not agreeing with its politics. it's possible each country can be ? in its OWN WAY.kingblaze84 wrote: »Does Venezuela's govt behead people for not being Muslim anymore, and even prevent women from driving?
Both Venezuela and Saudi Arabia have problems, but I think I'd have more freedoms in Venezuela compared to Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia has the advantage of having less crime, I'll admit that, but that's really as far as it goes. -
Have learnt a lot over the years
I been coming to this site not trying to put u down but JANKLOW YOU either trying to wind people up or your deluded my brother. Your the reason y people round the world think bad of Americans. I more lean to I think you winding people up cause no one cab b that stupid. -
please. i guarantee for all your "I'm not interesting in hearing any American denounce the human rights records of Cuba until they denounce the human rights record of their own nation first," there's something out there that you give a pass to when you like whoever's doing it. how many posters on this forum rail against country X or politician Y and say nothing when their side is doing the same ? ?Lol this is one of those things that sounds good but actually make no sense.
possibly because i was responding to someone who burst with uncritical passion for outlasting elected officials BECAUSE THEY ARE DICTATORS?How are you quick to condemn the Castros for 56 years of "not giving a ? about the rights of Cubans!" but also quick to defend America for 300+ years for not giving a ? about the rights of its minorities?
i mean, you're going back and pulling my quotes; do you want to pull the ones where i didn't criticize the things the US does that you're complaining about?This is the sentiment that you keep trying to deflect from. I'm not interesting in hearing any American denounce the human rights records of Cuba until they denounce the human rights record of their own nation first. -
ultimately neither is an ideal situation if you're not in line with the ruling government.kingblaze84 wrote: »Both Venezuela and Saudi Arabia have problems, but I think I'd have more freedoms in Venezuela compared to Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia has the advantage of having less crime, I'll admit that, but that's really as far as it goes.
yeah, you got me. i, random dude on a hip-hop internet forum, am the reason why "people round the world think bad of Americans." sorry about that.beneath the surface wrote: »Have learnt a lot over the years
I been coming to this site not trying to put u down but JANKLOW YOU either trying to wind people up or your deluded my brother. Your the reason y people round the world think bad of Americans. I more lean to I think you winding people up cause no one cab b that stupid. -
ultimately neither is an ideal situation if you're not in line with the ruling government.kingblaze84 wrote: »Both Venezuela and Saudi Arabia have problems, but I think I'd have more freedoms in Venezuela compared to Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia has the advantage of having less crime, I'll admit that, but that's really as far as it goes.
yeah, you got me. i, random dude on a hip-hop internet forum, am the reason why "people round the world think bad of Americans." sorry about that.beneath the surface wrote: »Have learnt a lot over the years
I been coming to this site not trying to put u down but JANKLOW YOU either trying to wind people up or your deluded my brother. Your the reason y people round the world think bad of Americans. I more lean to I think you winding people up cause no one cab b that stupid.
You probably don't do it ON PURPOSE but at times it seems you minimize the bad things America has done that has affected many, many people around the world, with no accountability. I know you've criticized some American policies obviously but you probably minimize America's brutal behavior worldwide without knowing it (or maybe you do). I do find myself wondering at times if you comprehend the LEVELS to what America has done that have been pure tragedy for many around the world and even here in this nation.
Not saying America is a terrible place, and that it should even be singled out, I've criticized many other nations here but people have mentioned this with you before. -
you know, i think i have said this before, but when you have posters who have the "America does bad ? " covered, i don't know that i need to spend that much time on it. especially since it's not "you don't criticize the US" but "you don't criticize the US ENOUGH." eh.kingblaze84 wrote: »You probably don't do it ON PURPOSE but at times it seems you minimize the bad things America has done that has affected many, many people around the world, with no accountability. I know you've criticized some American policies obviously but you probably minimize America's brutal behavior worldwide without knowing it (or maybe you do).
going to point out that "Your the reason y people round the world think bad of Americans" is not being paired with anything like an argument, so you can guess how seriously i take the commentary.kingblaze84 wrote: »but people have mentioned this with you before. -
Always wanted to smoke a cuban cigar.
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Seems like we only call terrorism terrorism when it isn't us or one of our allies.
