why do blacks still ? with MLK jr.?
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mlk helped change america;s perspective forever
if it wasnt for him and civil rights ? wouldnt be free totally
still stuck in those days our ancestors experienced -
interesting side note: that interesting side note is in the post-death autobiography]
And?and how the ? does 2Pac get ranked with Malcolm and MLK? come on
Ranked? Did I do a 1,2,3? I think the point I was trying to make was changing the history of a man after killing him. Not the concept of importance or worth. You should have slept a couple hours after working the night ? at Club Broke back before deciding to respond. Your not as lucid as you once were. LOLps. insert shock "wouldn't have been a post-death auto-bio if the NOI hadn't killed him" post here
Too simplistic and historically inaccurate. Three people were arrested, two were released and two more later apprehended. Talmadge Hayer said the two others convicted had nothing to do with it. The first two who were released were never heard from again. If you want to say some some members were involved, that would be fine, but the reality is there was involvement on many levels, including government.
Most people don't know of the back and forth scuffles and beat downs administered by Malcolm's camp on the renegades in the NOI. My family was in the Nation in NYC at the time before, during, and after. Sad part is most people outside of NYC would not have known Malcolm existed if White mainstream media hadn't decided to promote him to combat Farrakhan rising popularity among college students in the 90's.
But enough of that, how ya been? -
Actually, no. That is the autobiographical version advanced by Alex Haley, who admitted to removing chapters, particularly the one where Malcolm was communicating with Elijah to get back into the NOI. Bob Law has actual letters he wrote during that time period. Malcolm came to realize that the Sunnis were on the same ? when they left hajj. They treated African Muslims as ? boys and flunkies back home.
Interesting side note, Malcolm did not let whites join Muslim Mosque Inc. He said they could support but not join.
SMH at reading a post death autobiography and thinking that the white people who published wouldn't edit it to fit their agenda. Like the did Jesus, PAC, and MLK.
I appreciate the correction. Thank you. Im actually looking more into this because of what you said
I wouldn't place that above them, and i actually expect it. But, i understand where u are coming from w/ that statement. As a child growing up, the presentation of history we are fed has been intentionally repainted and obscured. Its one's personal duty to rid the surface ? and get a clearer and accurate picture (and share the truth after & while doing so) Its a never ending, yet, worthwhile process. So, excuse my ignorance, but im working on it lol
And its nice to have you back around.
any meaning behind that avi of yours? -
I was speaking about my Brothers with my brother..I felt no need to include specifics and particulars..we overstand eachother without the extras.
It might be a foreign concept to you but when I say our "own" Im not talking about some grandiose World surplus Im simply talking about controlling the economics in our own communities like other races. If you want to elaborate on trades between Mongolians and Eskimos go head and type the titan-graph.
You may have nightmares about being "herded onto reservations like the Native Americans" but thats corny considering that we alreaady live in housing-projects, and wards anyway.
We need control of our communities, our schools, our stores, and our culture...every other race understands that concept but we are so backwards that we cant fathom doing for self and being ourselves....
It's corny for you to compare housing projects to reservations. Housing projects are still owned by the government, reservations are land given to the Native American tribes but if Uncle Sam decides to take that land back (i.e. if massive oil reserves are found on res land, etc), there ain't ? that can be done about it. No matter what, housing projects are government owned, end of story.
Regarding other races and their communities: In America, unless it's a section of a city carved out for a specific population (i.e. Chinatown), most other races assimilate into the area they live in. Sure they may have stores here and there, but that's about it. The lone exception I'm aware of is the Middle Eastern population in the Detroit area (largest concentration of Middle Eastern peoples outside of the Middle East). They DO support themselves in every way as you describe EXCEPT schools. They still utilize public schools. The same schools the whites in the same areas send their kids to.
In America SE Asians do NOT have their own schools, they send their kids to the same schools everyone else sends their kids to. Same for Indians, Africans, Mexicans, and any other race or nationality that comes here. Unless they own in their communities, they don't control them like everyone else. They hang on to their culture for a while, but even then as they assimilate they lose touch until it's gone, usually within two generations.
For the black community to stand on it's own two, sadly, we have to start with rap. We need to go back to late 80's/early 90's ? again, when music had a message of empowerment. When I graduated high school, we got a sense that education was key to furthering ourselves and our communities. This was brought on us by KRS One, Public Enemy, Poor Righteous Teachers, X Clan, King Sun, King Just, Paris, The Coup, The Goats, and so many others that were getting airplay and video rotation. Our women didn't aspire to be the next "video hoe" or "barbie" because their musical role models were Queen Latifah, Monie Love, Isis, Queen Mother Rage, and though I didn't agree with Salt and Pepa's early messages, eventually they got it together and got positive later on. Stop supporting the ? coonery that's passing for rap and support those with a positive message and you'll begin to move the youth in a better direction. Bring education back to the forefront and put the XBox on the back burner. SHOW THEM BETTER BY BEING BETTER!!! Out Men need to stop having kids with random women and our women need to stop letting men run up in them unprotected without a ring on their finger. ("Too many women can say they're mothers, but can't say that they're wives" - Common). e need to push cats like Rick Ross, Young Jeezy, and TI off the stage and get Trap Rap off the air so young brothas can focus on reality instead of coke dreams.
Once that starts to happen, we can take our communities back. -
konceptjones wrote: »It's corny for you to compare housing projects to reservations. Housing projects are still owned by the government, reservations are land given to the Native American tribes but if Uncle Sam decides to take that land back (i.e. if massive oil reserves are found on res land, etc), there ain't ? that can be done about it. No matter what, housing projects are government owned, end of story.
Regarding other races and their communities: In America, unless it's a section of a city carved out for a specific population (i.e. Chinatown), most other races assimilate into the area they live in. Sure they may have stores here and there, but that's about it. The lone exception I'm aware of is the Middle Eastern population in the Detroit area (largest concentration of Middle Eastern peoples outside of the Middle East). They DO support themselves in every way as you describe EXCEPT schools. They still utilize public schools. The same schools the whites in the same areas send their kids to.
In America SE Asians do NOT have their own schools, they send their kids to the same schools everyone else sends their kids to. Same for Indians, Africans, Mexicans, and any other race or nationality that comes here. Unless they own in their communities, they don't control them like everyone else. They hang on to their culture for a while, but even then as they assimilate they lose touch until it's gone, usually within two generations.
For the black community to stand on it's own two, sadly, we have to start with rap. We need to go back to late 80's/early 90's ? again, when music had a message of empowerment. When I graduated high school, we got a sense that education was key to furthering ourselves and our communities. This was brought on us by KRS One, Public Enemy, Poor Righteous Teachers, X Clan, King Sun, King Just, Paris, The Coup, The Goats, and so many others that were getting airplay and video rotation. Our women didn't aspire to be the next "video hoe" or "barbie" because their musical role models were Queen Latifah, Monie Love, Isis, Queen Mother Rage, and though I didn't agree with Salt and Pepa's early messages, eventually they got it together and got positive later on. Stop supporting the ? coonery that's passing for rap and support those with a positive message and you'll begin to move the youth in a better direction. Bring education back to the forefront and put the XBox on the back burner. SHOW THEM BETTER BY BEING BETTER!!! Out Men need to stop having kids with random women and our women need to stop letting men run up in them unprotected without a ring on their finger. ("Too many women can say they're mothers, but can't say that they're wives" - Common). e need to push cats like Rick Ross, Young Jeezy, and TI off the stage and get Trap Rap off the air so young brothas can focus on reality instead of coke dreams.
Once that starts to happen, we can take our communities back.It's corny for you to compare housing projects to reservations. Housing projects are still owned by the government, reservations are land given to the Native American tribes but if Uncle Sam decides to take that land back (i.e. if massive oil reserves are found on res land, etc), there ain't ? that can be done about it. No matter what, housing projects are government owned, end of story.
Read this outloud. -
konceptjones wrote: »
For the black community to stand on it's own two, sadly, we have to start with rap. We need to go back to late 80's/early 90's ? again, when music had a message of empowerment. When I graduated high school, we got a sense that education was key to furthering ourselves and our communities. This was brought on us by KRS One, Public Enemy, Poor Righteous Teachers, X Clan, King Sun, King Just, Paris, The Coup, The Goats, and so many others that were getting airplay and video rotation. Our women didn't aspire to be the next "video hoe" or "barbie" because their musical role models were Queen Latifah, Monie Love, Isis, Queen Mother Rage, and though I didn't agree with Salt and Pepa's early messages, eventually they got it together and got positive later on. Stop supporting the ? coonery that's passing for rap and support those with a positive message and you'll begin to move the youth in a better direction. Bring education back to the forefront and put the XBox on the back burner. SHOW THEM BETTER BY BEING BETTER!!! Out Men need to stop having kids with random women and our women need to stop letting men run up in them unprotected without a ring on their finger. ("Too many women can say they're mothers, but can't say that they're wives" - Common). e need to push cats like Rick Ross, Young Jeezy, and TI off the stage and get Trap Rap off the air so young brothas can focus on reality instead of coke dreams.
Once that starts to happen, we can take our communities back.
Id say its beyond rap. Rap is in accord with mainstream "values" and sentiments of America. Its just presented differently. That period of rap you mentioned was the result of a view of ourselves and our surroundings from our own eyes and minds. Today's rap is a result of viewing urself and ur surroundings from an inherited point of view. It goes beyond music.
If we can take control of our own minds instead of being told how to view ourselves and how the world we live in, the communities will change, and the music will to. The remnants of the movements from earlier decades created the hip hop we are speaking of.
Consensus (or whats presented as such) is constructed by minds outside these communities, with their own vantage point and motives. If we can detach ourselves from that, things will get better. ? , that will help out everyone, not only black people
Rap is nothing more than a reflection/result of reality. Not a cause, nor a buttress -
I Self Lord & Master wrote: »Id say its beyond rap. Rap is in accord with mainstream "values" and sentiments of America. Its just presented differently. That period of rap you mentioned was the result of a view of ourselves and our surroundings from our own eyes and minds. Today's rap is a result of viewing urself and ur surroundings from an inherited point of view. It goes beyond music.
If we can take control of our own minds instead of being told how to view ourselves and how the world we live in, the communities will change, and the music will to. The remnants of the movements from earlier decades created the hip hop we are speaking of.
Consensus (or whats presented as such) is constructed by minds outside these communities, with their own vantage point and motives. If we can detach ourselves from that, things will get better. ? , that will help out everyone, not only black people
Rap is nothing more than a reflection/result of reality. Not a cause, nor a buttress
I'll disagree with this.
Todays rap is directly influenced by corporate greed and ultimately used as a means to keep it's listeners in a state of disarray. Where it once organized and pushed to better ourselves while listening to uplifting messages, the youth now run around frontin like they slang or actually slangin, lookin for "buss it baby's" instead of good black women, focusing on the faux reality of hip hop videos and the dream that MTV pushes via "Cribs", staying intoxicated on overpriced liquor because the latest hot rapper mentioned a drink in his song... I could probably go on forever but you get the point. Understand that the messages we receive via music are NOT controlled by us. When the Telcom Act of 1996 passed all but a handfull of radio stations that catered to black audiences across the country were bought and their formats altered to push more ignorant music than positive. Even BET got caught up, where once you could regularly see music videos by positive artists, now you simply cannot (I remember Blackstar's "Respiration" staying on to of the Rap City Countdown for a good minute).
They recognized that rap was a powerful tool for change, in the right hands it pushed us to be better, in their hands it's pushing us to new lows. -
konceptjones wrote: »I'll disagree with this.
Todays rap is directly influenced by corporate greed and ultimately used as a means to keep it's listeners in a state of disarray. Where it once organized and pushed to better ourselves while listening to uplifting messages, the youth now run around frontin like they slang or actually slangin, lookin for "buss it baby's" instead of good black women, focusing on the faux reality of hip hop videos and the dream that MTV pushes via "Cribs", staying intoxicated on overpriced liquor because the latest hot rapper mentioned a drink in his song... I could probably go on forever but you get the point. Understand that the messages we receive via music are NOT controlled by us. When the Telcom Act of 1996 passed all but a handfull of radio stations that catered to black audiences across the country were bought and their formats altered to push more ignorant music than positive. Even BET got caught up, where once you could regularly see music videos by positive artists, now you simply cannot (I remember Blackstar's "Respiration" staying on to of the Rap City Countdown for a good minute).
They recognized that rap was a powerful tool for change, in the right hands it pushed us to be better, in their hands it's pushing us to new lows.
It seems as if our thoughts are parallel in a lot of ways. I agree with your general message, and i dont see how it contests mine. The mainstream has NEVER shown black people in a positive light. People complain about hip hop promoting stereotypes , but these SAME stereotypes have been in minds since the 1800's. How can an ancient problem be attributed to a recent phenomenon?...kinda getting off point..
But we never controlled they way we were portrayed to the world, but that didnt stop us in earlier decades. We disregarded their defamation and 'superior ideals and ideas' and formed our own communities and were proud of who we were. Which lead to considerable prosperity and several black power movements that were tailored to suit our needs and interests. That came from disregarding how we were taught to look at ourselves and our situation, and viewing ourselves from our own vantage point.
Cutting that leash off of our mind today would have the same revolutionary effects it had in the past.
And i agree that rap was a powerful tool for change. The MOST powerful since the 60s. But that doesnt weaken my point -
yeah bruh. it ? us up like a muthafucka. like before intergration you wouldnt here ? clownin a nother ? cause he was smart or spoke with elequence. ? clowned you cause you was a ? /didnt try to learn. now ? clown you for being smart or talking elequent aka white but ? like playmaker and others get mad when ? do that but cant understand it was mlk jr.'s doing. dumb ?
they know our mentals... so wen we got integrated they flipped the script on us.. now wat was once cool for us, they made it lame, and wat was looked down upon by us they made cool... they knew wat measures to take to fool us... im jus mad at MLK not walking side by side wit Malcolm and not working together and politicing tgether. i think as a team they woulda be unstoppable and they wouldnt have that mentality in their head about gettin killed.. cuz they seemed to not care bout gettin killed as a message to the govt... -
I Self Lord & Master wrote: »I appreciate the correction. Thank you. Im actually looking more into this because of what you said
I wouldn't place that above them, and i actually expect it. But, i understand where u are coming from w/ that statement. As a child growing up, the presentation of history we are fed has been intentionally repainted and obscured. Its one's personal duty to rid the surface ? and get a clearer and accurate picture (and share the truth after & while doing so) Its a never ending, yet, worthwhile process. So, excuse my ignorance, but im working on it lol
And its nice to have you back around.
any meaning behind that avi of yours?
Good to be back, I self
I am recovering from an affliction and it just represents a stage on my journey to wholeness. -
man ? mlk. yall ? can believe in that ? all you want but the proof is in the pudding. if he would of taught economical freedom first. then would of said then get yall integration cool. but he was like get hit with rock and bricks, watch four little girls get killed for going to church etc just so you can be the friend of a people who will never like you no matter what. by any means necessary then go ahead and ride with him but when i put my hood on the map as a model for other black communities and do what king could never do i want all yall to suck my ? .. no ? needed. im from the old school.
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man ? mlk. yall ? can believe in that ? all you want but the proof is in the pudding. if he would of taught economical freedom first. then would of said then get yall integration cool. but he was like get hit with rock and bricks, watch four little girls get killed for going to church etc just so you can be the friend of a people who will never like you no matter what. by any means necessary then go ahead and ride with him but when i put my hood on the map as a model for other black communities and do what king could never do i want all yall to suck my ? .. no ? needed. im from the old school.
Huuuuussshh fool!!! Massah hear you tawkin dat mess we gawn be in a whole heap o' trouble!!
Wass da matter wit you?? You eat good vittles you got wi-fi...why you wanna be a damn heathen boy?? -
LMAO......MLK wasn't a perfect man, but he did his part. Whoever wants to start their own movement now is more than welcome to.......
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man ? mlk. yall ? can believe in that ? all you want but the proof is in the pudding. if he would of taught economical freedom first. then would of said then get yall integration cool. but he was like get hit with rock and bricks, watch four little girls get killed for going to church etc just so you can be the friend of a people who will never like you no matter what. by any means necessary then go ahead and ride with him but when i put my hood on the map as a model for other black communities and do what king could never do i want all yall to suck my ? .. no ? needed. im from the old school.
it's no coincidence that MLK was murdered after he began to take a more Black Nationalist stance. Pay attention to his more obscure speeches towards the end of his life, many of the themes were more in line with Malcolm X than the old "I Have A Dream" MLK. -
and it's in there, which is just getting noted. which is mainly relevant since the gist of your post was the whole "changing the history of a man after killing him" thing that sort of implies it's the kind of thing the book would leave out.And?
you've got a short list of Malcolm, MLK, Jesus ... and 2Pac. they don't need a ranking down to who's #1 and who's #2 to look at that list and say "one of these things is not like the other"Ranked? Did I do a 1,2,3?
IT BEGINSYou should have slept a couple hours after working the night ? at Club Broke back before deciding to respond. Your not as lucid as you once were. LOL
well, two things:Too simplistic and historically inaccurate. Three people were arrested, two were released and two more later apprehended. Talmadge Hayer said the two others convicted had nothing to do with it. The first two who were released were never heard from again. If you want to say some some members were involved, that would be fine, but the reality is there was involvement on many levels, including government.
01. this is not a contention that every person ever accused/convicted of killing Malcolm was guilty;
02. usually my theory breaks down to "the NOI talked reckless about Malcolm and some lesser-ranking member thought, "? it, the higher-ups would probably appreciate it if i shot Malcolm." would i be stunned if someone like Farrakhan WAS legitimately involved in a complicated conspiracy? no, but it's not my guess.
same old, same oldBut enough of that, how ya been? -
Yo growin up i was the most militant brother ever, i had pictures of The Honorable Elihag Muhamad, Malcolm X, Huey P Newton, Farakhan, Muhamad Ali on my wall, rockin out to PE, NWA, X Clan, Asxari X, Paris, 2pac, Ice Cube. first book i copped at 14 was Off the Pigs 10 point commandment of the Black Panther Party, reads books like Soul on Ice, Manchild in the promise land, Revolutionary Suicide. I from that era of Fight the Power movies like School Daze, Do The Right Thing ect. The Gen X era, when i our leader in the Hood was Dr Khalid Muhammad and Tupac Shakur. I always thought Martin Luther King was a bootlicking house ? . I was following ? and not even thinkin on my own. Im a grown ass man now and still down with the Nat Turners and Malcolm X. But one day i copped this book A Testament of Hope: The Essential Writings and Speeches of Martin Luther King, Jr. And i have to say I didnt know ? about the Man. He's is a Revolutionary, A Warrior and a Strong Man. even though i didnt agree with that turn the other cheek ? . But I was wrong. I will never disrespect him as long as i am alive, that book blew my mind like the autobiography of MALCOLM X.
Brothas like him and Malcolmx come once ever few hundered years. And before he died he was about to get the poor together and fight for food, clothing, work, housing and medicare for all. As a Black Man i like to say thank you to The KING -
good ? going on in here and nice discussions and different point of views. and h rap you funny as ? with that ? ? .
