Honestly, who do YOU blame for the Recession?
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Mister B.
Members, Writer Posts: 16,172 ✭✭✭✭✭
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I blame Bush more than anyone, Obama to a large degree for not having any new ideas to make things better.
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anyone blaming [insert president's name here] is doing this wrong
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Whoever controls the money, the big banks I guess
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Dot Com bubble, real estate bubble, Alan Greenspan, American greed and exceptionalism. predatory lending with lack of regulation which turned a good deed into a horror story. Worthless credit rating agencies. Abuses still occur today even under Obama but unlike Bush, he's trying to do something to stop it.
@kingblaze84 you gonna sit there and act like Obama can anything legislated or funded with this congress? I'm surprised he's doing this well.
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FuriousOne wrote: »Dot Com bubble, real estate bubble, Alan Greenspan, American greed and existentialism. predatory lending with lack of regulation which turned a good deed into a horror story. Worthless credit rating agencies. Abuses still occur today even under Obama but unlike Bush, he's trying to do something to stop it.
@kingblaze84 you gonna sit there and act like Obama can anything legislated or funded with this congress? I'm surprised he's doing this well.
Obama is helping spend 2 billion a week in Afghanistan, bankrupting the nation homie. That adds up to about 100 billion per year, not including the costs of treating wounded soldiers. Obama's spending policies have been a disaster.That money should be used to build up infrastructure here in America, as Democrats and independents say all the time. Obama won't budge in Afghanistan though, so YES, he deserves partial blame for the recession. If Obama would stop wasting tax payer dollars in Afghanistan, we would have more money to spend here in America. Obama also extended the Bush tax cuts, FURTHER bankrupting the nation and making it even harder to create job growth in the public sector. The public sector was vibrant during the Clinton years, why? Because Clinton raised taxes on the rich and didn't prolong neverending wars. Obama, being the ? made ? he is, caved on the Bush tax cuts, and that is why he has lost the respect of so many liberals and moderates such as myself.
Obama could also help encourage economic growth by telling the Department of Justice to stop cracking down on medicinal marijuana shops, but NOOOOOOOO, Obama wants to be a ? ? and maintain the status quo. He's cracked down harder on medical marijuana shops even harder than Bush has. Obama told the Department of Justice to stop enforcing the laws on the Defense of Marriage Act, to protect ? rights. What about the rights of states to increase revenue by producing medical marijuana, something that can easily create hundreds of thousands of jobs? Many states have on the books that medical marijuana shops can be open, but the ? ? federal govt still is persecuting medical marijuana. ? ? made Obama and ? Bush, they both have been terrible presidents (with Bush being worst). -
The Reagan administration.
It all started back in the 1980s when more wealth and power began being concentrated in fewer and fewer hands. Trickle down economics gave companies more profits while regular people suffered job losses and a plummeting economy. The effects of that administration carried over into George H Bush's presidency and was cleaned up somewhat by Clinton, but then it all went to ? again with George W. Bush. Obama's trying to clean it up, but damage from reagan's term are already done.
Yes, Reagan deserves a ton of blame for our current problems. He's the most overrated president in American history, and that's why I'm still angry Obama extended the Bush tax cuts and bailed out rich companies while giving crumbs to the middle and working classes. Why Obama extended the Bush tax cuts for another 4 years, with Democrats and the Senate telling him not to, I'll never know. He's lost my respect ever since. -
SawedOff-N-SkiMask wrote: »^^^ u don't understand ? about Business and Politics (and racism) so I'll just leave u alone. Oh yeah, and part of that $2billion goes to helping the soldiers, I'm loving how u assume what's already in the budget. $100billion isn't ? for the Federal Reserve. The power the banks have over America goes back to The Great Depression. I see it's clear that u ? don't know about ? before the ? Era, that's all u care about is the ? Era. ? don't never wanna learn ? .
"Teaching a ? how to read is like teaching a lazy ? how to save his money" - Roman Champagne
You're very ignorant if you think 100 billion doesn't go a long way. That 100 billion can bail out cities like Detroit and Stockholm, California, so you're the one that's extremely dumb here. As far as politics, I like presidents with ? and who aren't ? cowards. Someone like Martin Luther King, who wasn't afraid to die for what he believed, as I do. Obama has the spine of a little worm who cowers before every challenge before him. The banks do have a huge influence in this nation obviously, but so does the most powerful job in the world. You know what I notice about you?
When ? shut your whole post down, as it happens consistently, you resort to name calling. Just take the fact that you are arguably the most ignorant poster in this thread now and suck it up. Come up with some facts or shut the ? up. Obama sucks as a president, come up with some good arguments that prove why he isn't. Yes he's done a lot of good, but people are disappointed in him. That disappoints you? Fine, but don't resort to name calling because so many Blacks and Americans in general are disgusted with Obama. -
And as I said, that 100 billion being spent in Afghanistan does not include the costs of treating wounded vets......
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Machines taking humans jobs in factories
and
illegal immigrants working for dirt cheap (landscaping, cleaning, etc)
and
Huge companies outsourcing to China and South America, where kids are basically doing slave labour. Huge companies don't have to give them benefits, and don't have to enforce any humane safety conditions for them. They save tons of money.
In the end, the middle class American man loses out on jobs. And the huge companies save lots of money. IE. The Rich get richer.
The government knows all of this is happening and they don't do anything to correct it. Blame the government. they're the only ones that could step to the huge companies, and stop illegal immigration.
i'm not saying these are the only reasons for the recession, but it sure doesn't help when people who were making $45K a year get laid off because their job is moved to china where a kid gets paid 2$ per week to do that same job.
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SawedOff-N-SkiMask wrote: »^^^ u don't understand ? about Business and Politics (and racism) so I'll just leave u alone. Oh yeah, and part of that $2billion goes to helping the soldiers, I'm loving how u assume what's already in the budget. $100billion isn't ? for the Federal Reserve. The power the banks have over America goes back to The Great Depression. I see it's clear that u ? don't know about ? before the ? Era, that's all u care about is the ? Era. ? don't never wanna learn ? .
"Teaching a ? how to read is like teaching a lazy ? how to save his money" - Roman Champagne
LOLOL @kingblaze84
Fam he KILLED you with that post. Seeing as how the bailout of the banking industry and economy was about $730 billion dollars I'd say he killed you on this son. $100 billion definitely goes quite a way in this current environment.
You lost credibility when you blamed the current President LOLOLOL. Buuuuut I'm not even gonna start LOLOL.
I didn't blame Obama for the recession, I said he deserves SOME blame for his terrible policies. If I'm so wrong, why do most Americans disapprove of Obama's handling on the economy lol -
SawedOff-N-SkiMask wrote: »But REAL LIFE doesn't work that way. U ? r living in a fantasy where "doing the right thing" is nothing but a flick of a Pen.
I never said $100billion isn't ? , but COMPARED to the Federal Reserve it ain't ? . If u really think that the United States and it's Global partners only have a trillion dollars tops then may I welcome you to the 21st century.
$100billion isn't gonna bail out Detroit, the Automobile industry IS Detroit. You can only have so many jobs and careers in a place full of Traumatized Black people. I'm sorry to say that but it's the truth.
It's all in the mind and DUMB ? don't seem to get that at all. Classes are still in session, drugs are still profitable, food stamps are still being handed out, hoes is still sellin ? , clubs are still being packed, and the Internet is still worldwide. And that's what u guys don't seem to get, it's a mental thing more than a psychical thing.
I'm not trying to be cavalier or disrespectful to the people about the economy around there (and elsewhere) but when u have 100 ? with Guns, Drugs, Money, Lawyers, Cops, and ? u can only do so much blaming of the other man. It's not Obama's fault ? don't wanna Unite and put their Money together. That ? is so sad how u ? just want and expect hand outs like that knowing outle Country never gave us ? but yet we're still waiting on our Savior/Messiah. The Indians (from India) didn't do that, Middle Easterners don't really do that, Mexicans don't do that, only African Americans.
? really honestly believe that 1 day we're all gonna be equal in this society and until then we should wait on the sidelines while literally everybody else in the world moves on. Black Americans are a mentally sick people (and yes I love being Black btw) and that's the truth.
You're sitting back blaming the Black guy for finally "fitting in" when there's other ? to worry about. U don't really care about the Iraq-Afgan War, u don't give a ? about Global warming and whatever, u only care about it becuz someone FINALLY put a price tag on something. U could care less what goes on around the world. The last 3 Republicans weren't ? but yet u run off at the mouth like Obama has done worse and he isn't changing ? for the better. So I'm sayin, if somebody sells u a "bucket" (car) and u know it's gonna need maintainence you're gonna ignore it and say "well I don't wanna waste money on a new fuel pump, battery, manifold intake, and a/c. I'm just gonna ride it til the wheels fall off". You're stupid, just becuz there's a few Laws that Black folks never really benefitted from doesn't mean that the system was broke and corrupt the whole time.
And think about this, all of these President CANDIDATES have always promised such and such but never quickly got to it, don't u think that means something, isn't that a little perculiar to u? There's no University you can go to to read a manual on how to be President with REAL AMD FACTUAL numbers and statistics, u find out everything when u get in. No Government in their right mind is gonna broadcast all of its secrets, if it did we woulda lost a very long time ago, u probably wouldn't even be on your iPhone or Computer right now.
I don't think you can read very well, you gota step your intelligence game up. I gave example after example of things Obama can do to help with the weak economy. You think just cuz clubs are full and drugs are still selling that the economy isn't doing too bad? LOL come on dum dum, there are still plenty of people suffering out there. Read a ? economic magazine for once in your life to at least pretend to be smart.
I'll repeat this for you, since you're obviously slow. Obama should end the war in Afghanistan and dedicate those resources here at home. Obama can also execute an executive order telling the Department of Justice to end the raids on medical marijuana, thereby making businesses nervous about raids NO LONGER nervous, in return creating ? knows how many jobs.
Obama helped bankrupt the nation further extending the Bush tax cuts.....the money we couldv'e raised from taxing the rich heavier could have created new revenue for the govt, and would have saved many govt jobs and would have made Congress less nervous about new infrastructure spending.
As I have said, I don't blame Obama for the most part. Bush, Reagan, and others have done far worse. But Obama has ? things up by extending Republican tactics and strategies that clearly don't work in the long run. You know, tactics like neverending wars that only benefit a few corporations and tax cuts that only benefit the few as well. Obama has done much good obviously, but his lack of new ideas (like decriminalizing or at least relaxing rules on med marijuana through executive orders which would create jobs) is causing his poll numbers to still be shaky. There's a reason he can campaign on hope and change anymore, he's disappointed too many of his own supporters, including former supporters such as myself. He's gonna have an uphill battle November, let's see if he can grow some ? in the next couple of months. Doubt he will, he's too much of a ? .
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KINGOFDAARCADE wrote: »Machines taking humans jobs in factories
and
illegal immigrants working for dirt cheap (landscaping, cleaning, etc)
and
Huge companies outsourcing to China and South America, where kids are basically doing slave labour. Huge companies don't have to give them benefits, and don't have to enforce any humane safety conditions for them. They save tons of money.
In the end, the middle class American man loses out on jobs. And the huge companies save lots of money. IE. The Rich get richer.
The government knows all of this is happening and they don't do anything to correct it. Blame the government. they're the only ones that could step to the huge companies, and stop illegal immigration.
i'm not saying these are the only reasons for the recession, but it sure doesn't help when people who were making $45K a year get laid off because their job is moved to china where a kid gets paid 2$ per week to do that same job.
Co-sign, govt is not doing nothing to help with this. Especially the ? federal govt.... -
kingblaze84 wrote: »
Obama is helping spend 2 billion a week in Afghanistan, bankrupting the nation homie. That adds up to about 100 billion per year, not including the costs of treating wounded soldiers. Obama's spending policies have been a disaster.That money should be used to build up infrastructure here in America, as Democrats and independents say all the time. Obama won't budge in Afghanistan though, so YES, he deserves partial blame for the recession. If Obama would stop wasting tax payer dollars in Afghanistan, we would have more money to spend here in America. Obama also extended the Bush tax cuts, FURTHER bankrupting the nation and making it even harder to create job growth in the public sector. The public sector was vibrant during the Clinton years, why? Because Clinton raised taxes on the rich and didn't prolong neverending wars. Obama, being the ? made ? he is, caved on the Bush tax cuts, and that is why he has lost the respect of so many liberals and moderates such as myself.
Obama could also help encourage economic growth by telling the Department of Justice to stop cracking down on medicinal marijuana shops, but NOOOOOOOO, Obama wants to be a ? ? and maintain the status quo. He's cracked down harder on medical marijuana shops even harder than Bush has. Obama told the Department of Justice to stop enforcing the laws on the Defense of Marriage Act, to protect ? rights. What about the rights of states to increase revenue by producing medical marijuana, something that can easily create hundreds of thousands of jobs? Many states have on the books that medical marijuana shops can be open, but the ? ? federal govt still is persecuting medical marijuana. ? ? made Obama and ? Bush, they both have been terrible presidents (with Bush being worst).
You're really reaching with this son dun. First point, He never said he was getting out of Afghanistan but he's actually attempted to complete an operation that was largely abandoned yet still cost us money anyway. At the same time, he drew down the Iraq war (or was kicked out as some like to point out). Afghanistan was the country that gave refuge to the dudes who took down the towers which is why we were there in the first place. He got Osama, the main dude, and killed a bunch of his homeboys. All the while, he has to deal with naysayers on opposing team who are ? up negotiations.
Obama stopped the recession from toppling this country. He handed out loans to American companies that mostly paid them back while Bush let the Bankers get away scot-free. Obama had nothing to do with the bank bailouts. He did have everything to do with saving and making better a uniquely American company. This is both good for future gains, morale and image. Clinton did not have a huge ass recession on his door step and Obama doesn't have a great internet bubble to ride. Clinton also put forward the low mortgage rates that was packaged as predatory loans which is actually what sunk the economy. It was an inspirational idea that went horribly wrong under Bush II.
Multiple cities are pushing forward the agenda of marijuana legalization just like the ? agenda was pushed forward. I have no opinion on what people do physically to one another in their own bedroom. I gives a ? about marriage in general honestly. You can marry a goat for all i care. I do think Marijuana should be legal and I'm not sure what Obama's aim is here. So we can agree on this subject. There weren't nearly as many medical marijuana fronts available under Bush so it's pointless to compare what bush would have done. I do believe that Obama would be the only person to yield as president with enough people being consistently vocal and continuous state and local support.
You are being facetious when you say Obama extended the Bush tax cuts because you know that it was tied to unemployment by the Republicans. For a person who harps about jobs as often as you do, I'm sure you wouldn't have wanted to see people go without unemployment. It was a battle that could be saved for a less troubling times like next year when Obama is reelected. Obama is not even in the ballpark of being worse then Bush. Dude actually got lots done under great pressure and obstruction. People are benefiting from his policies. My nephew is installing windmills, my taxes are great, I was able to consolidate my federal loans, and I can even get relatively inexpensive health care with my preexisting conditions. Obama's presidency isn't nearly as bleak as you're describing it.
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SawedOff-N-SkiMask wrote: »But u DO blame Obama for the most part, that's y u keep saying the ? you're saying. You don't realize that 90% of what Obama did in his first 2 years was gonna happen anyway.
U don't walk into an expensive store and just take the ? and leave, you HAVE TO PAY. And who else is going to fund the ? , the same people that got us there in the 1st place. U don't make over $250k so I don't know you're so worried about the Bush Tax Cuts.
When the oil spill in the gulf happened they didn't blame the workers, they blamed the Exec (the President). He didn't have ? to do with it but they put the blame on him....why, becuz as a Company (Government) u need to have someone u can point to for the mistakes of everybody.
And u haven't presented facts (not really), just a whole bunch of propaganda and irrelevant ? . Like I said, when ? stop crying and looking for hands outs that's when we'll get that Change we're looking for (if you're even Black).
"if they beat us right and teach us right what makes u think they're gonna feed us right"
See, this is why I think you're stupid. I have said over and over again, Obama is NOT to blame for the most part. He has ? up things in many aspects, specifically in his horrible ideas for the economy and his endless love of war spending that isn't doing anything for Americans except make us more hated around the world, creating more Bin Ladens. Obama has been a miserable failure as president, and that is the reason he is dissed so often all the time these days.
If it makes you feel better though, he's better than Romney and will likely win because of that. Are you happy you ? idiot? Obama is a bad prez, but Romney is worse. That's the best way I can sum it up. I want a FIGHTER as prez, not a spineless coward who extends Bush tax cuts among other horrible policies.
Vote Obama if you want man, I could care less at this point. Whether Romney wins or Obama wins, America's future is ? anyway. I'm just glad I have some money in the bank to go crazy when I want to. Just feel sorry for the many homeless and desperate people I see outside begging for money whenever I go to work, while Wall Street got the biggest welfare check in American history. -
FuriousOne wrote: »kingblaze84 wrote: »
Obama is helping spend 2 billion a week in Afghanistan, bankrupting the nation homie. That adds up to about 100 billion per year, not including the costs of treating wounded soldiers. Obama's spending policies have been a disaster.That money should be used to build up infrastructure here in America, as Democrats and independents say all the time. Obama won't budge in Afghanistan though, so YES, he deserves partial blame for the recession. If Obama would stop wasting tax payer dollars in Afghanistan, we would have more money to spend here in America. Obama also extended the Bush tax cuts, FURTHER bankrupting the nation and making it even harder to create job growth in the public sector. The public sector was vibrant during the Clinton years, why? Because Clinton raised taxes on the rich and didn't prolong neverending wars. Obama, being the ? made ? he is, caved on the Bush tax cuts, and that is why he has lost the respect of so many liberals and moderates such as myself.
Obama could also help encourage economic growth by telling the Department of Justice to stop cracking down on medicinal marijuana shops, but NOOOOOOOO, Obama wants to be a ? ? and maintain the status quo. He's cracked down harder on medical marijuana shops even harder than Bush has. Obama told the Department of Justice to stop enforcing the laws on the Defense of Marriage Act, to protect ? rights. What about the rights of states to increase revenue by producing medical marijuana, something that can easily create hundreds of thousands of jobs? Many states have on the books that medical marijuana shops can be open, but the ? ? federal govt still is persecuting medical marijuana. ? ? made Obama and ? Bush, they both have been terrible presidents (with Bush being worst).
You're really reaching with this son dun. First point, He never said he was getting out of Afghanistan but he's actually attempted to complete an operation that was largely abandoned yet still cost us money anyway. At the same time, he drew down the Iraq war (or was kicked out as some like to point out). Afghanistan was the country that gave refuge to the dudes who took down the towers which is why we were there in the first place. He got Osama, the main dude, and killed a bunch of his homeboys. All the while, he has to deal with naysayers on opposing team who are ? up negotiations.
Obama stopped the recession from toppling this country. He handed out loans to American companies that mostly paid them back while Bush let the Bankers get away scot-free. Obama had nothing to do with the bank bailouts. He did have everything to do with saving and making better a uniquely American company. This is both good for future gains, morale and image. Clinton did not have a huge ass recession on his door step and Obama doesn't have a great internet bubble to ride. Clinton also put forward the low mortgage rates that was packaged as predatory loans which is actually what sunk the economy. It was an inspirational idea that went horribly wrong under Bush II.
Multiple cities are pushing forward the agenda of marijuana legalization just like the ? agenda was pushed forward. I have no opinion on what people do physically to one another in their own bedroom. I gives a ? about marriage in general honestly. You can marry a goat for all i care. I do think Marijuana should be legal and I'm not sure what Obama's aim is here. So we can agree on this subject. There weren't nearly as many medical marijuana fronts available under Bush so it's pointless to compare what bush would have done. I do believe that Obama would be the only person to yield as president with enough people being consistently vocal and continuous state and local support.
You are being facetious when you say Obama extended the Bush tax cuts because you know that it was tied to unemployment by the Republicans. For a person who harps about jobs as often as you do, I'm sure you wouldn't have wanted to see people go without unemployment. It was a battle that could be saved for a less troubling times like next year when Obama is reelected. Obama is not even in the ballpark of being worse then Bush. Dude actually got lots done under great pressure and obstruction. People are benefiting from his policies. My nephew is installing windmills, my taxes are great, I was able to consolidate my federal loans, and I can even get relatively inexpensive health care with my preexisting conditions. Obama's presidency isn't nearly as bleak as you're describing it.
I'm gonna have a field day with this post.....let me eat my Chinese food first lol -
he's probably not the MOST overrated president ever, but he's definitely overhyped by the current generation of Republicans. the question you have to ask, though, is are they overrating Reagan or their fictional vision of Reagan? because he raised taxes.kingblaze84 wrote: »He's the most overrated president in American history-
honestly, i think kingblaze's more right about it: Obama has NEVER opposed these tax cuts except when they relate to the very rich, but the tax cuts in general are what cost that massive amount of money. it's a little facetious to say they're totally to be blamed on Republicans and/or that it's something he's giving the Republicans to get a deal when Obama's position seems to have always been "i'm cool with the majority of these tax cuts."FuriousOne wrote: »You are being facetious when you say Obama extended the Bush tax cuts because you know that it was tied to unemployment by the Republicans.
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honestly, i think kingblaze's more right about it: Obama has NEVER opposed these tax cuts except when they relate to the very rich, but the tax cuts in general are what cost that massive amount of money. it's a little facetious to say they're totally to be blamed on Republicans and/or that it's something he's giving the Republicans to get a deal when Obama's position seems to have always been "i'm cool with the majority of these tax cuts."
He wasn't cool with the tax cuts for the rich. He was cool with the tax cuts for the middle class. He wanted everyone making over a certain amount to pay more. There was a debate that almost let the unemployment lapse because of republican obstructionism. He had to let it slide to get the benefits. He also said he will not extend it for any reason but i'm not sure how far he'll get without a congress voting his way. He fought to end the drama and wanted the democrats to stop fighting so the republicans can stop holding unemployment hostage. What other option did you see? It's not like they had the vote.
theweek.com/article/index/209226/obamas-surrender-on-bush-tax-cuts
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kingblaze84 wrote: »I'm gonna have a field day with this post.....let me eat my Chinese food first lol
Don't take too long to digest.
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Bush's war on terrorism for oil.
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The recession was caused by one word: DEBT!
Everybody went into debt because we have become a debt-based society. Back in the day not everyone could get credit but companies found that they can charge high interest rates to people with poor credit and boom you have:
Credit Cards (which used to only be for the upper class)
Mortgages/Home Loans
Student Loans
Car Loans
Payday loans
All these things blossomed out of the idea that people can spend money they don't have and pay a little bit more for the privilege.
The banks tanked because they gambled with more money than they had, the housing market tanked because banks gave loans (at outrageous rates) to people who probably could/couldn't afford it at the time or people just plain didn't understand what they had signed.
I've talked to people in credit card debt and seen stories about people with mortgage debt and it all boils down to it being complicated to follow and difficult understand. The terms are bad enough, then comes the mathematics...but the devil is of course in the details.
I blame the recession on the bankers, the lack of competent government oversight and the DEBT society without all these things the world would be fine. -
I'm going to step out on a limb and vote for the black guy again because i love his policy on being born black
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The banks, Wall Street, and the real estate elite are to blame. Bush's and Cheney's wasteful spending on the war for oil is a recent factor that just added to the recession. If Romney wins expect more wasteful and needless spending. Silver spoon Romney dont care or give a ? about us. OBAMA 2012-2016 we have to stay united and focused and thats to get the ? back in the White House.
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Honestly, I blame the recession on three groups of people:
1) Congress - They saw the corruption going on in Wall St and did little to stop until it was too late.
2) Wall St. - Obviously
3) The American public - Collectively, people are financial nitwits with money. You had ? making $37K per year buying $350K homes and Escalades. You had folk barely making more than minimum wages with iPads, iPhone 4s with they were $500, and dying to have the latest Jordans and such. The main problem with the public was, as a whole, everyone has been trying to keep up with the Joneses...and bankrupting themselves to do it. -
uh... did you read what i posted?FuriousOne wrote: »He wasn't cool with the tax cuts for the rich. He was cool with the tax cuts for the middle class. He wanted everyone making over a certain amount to pay more.
"Obama has NEVER opposed these tax cuts except when they relate to the very rich"
so again, yes, Obama supported the Bush tax cuts EXCEPT for when they related to the very rich. the thing is, it's not ONLY the tax cuts aimed at the very rich that are costing the massive amounts of money he's supposedly trying to recover.
let me restate: if you SUPPORT the tax cuts for, say, the middle class, you can't then claim those same tax cuts are something you gave the Republicans as a compromise. this is not an endorsement of whatever Republican tactics; this is saying Obama's support for Bush tax cuts should be seen as Obama's support for Bush tax cuts.FuriousOne wrote: »He fought to end the drama and wanted the democrats to stop fighting so the republicans can stop holding unemployment hostage. What other option did you see? It's not like they had the vote.
This discussion has been closed.