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[/quote]Patriarchy= systems of ? and oppression. It didn't die with royalty. Corporate profiteering is all apart of patriarchy in modern day as it has its own systems of hierarchies. Again, patriarchal thinking created the hierarchies of class and ? people over. Capitalism and patriarchy, as I have said, go hand in hand.
LOL at you acting like Black people aren't affected by gender and it's just a "cultural thing" that happened in a vacuum. Duh, ? , we live in a patriarchal country where people are socialized on this ? . And I wasn't just talking about Black men. I'm talking about men in general--you all cling on to sexist ideas of masculinity because you don't have the guts to think what you'd be without it.
Typing that I don't give a ? really means that I do? Wow, you're a ? genius.
I swear, the Rapture will come before you ? even begin to grasp these concepts. ? it--I don't have the patience.[/quote]
This sounds like victim talk. So you are being dominated and oppressed by corporations to the point that you aren't allowed to read, write drive a car, start a business, be ? etc let's not act like it's the middle east over here and corporations(rich people) restrain women like a sultan. Also Capitalism has it's flaws and in the US it's more like psuedo-captialism, but I don't see nothing wrong with someone leveraging their skills to make money while providing a service/product to their customer. People don't like capitalism because they don't know how to compete in commerce and they think the system is rigged against them, because they don't think outside the box.
I've seen quite a few women business owners so to say capitalism and patriarchy go hand in hand is outdated and stupid.
Let's not act like women aren't also competitive they are more and can't be ruthless as well if given power. Also there are women who have accomplished many things under patriarchal societies and were humble while initiating change to the point to where you have it pretty good now so to hear you complain about patriarchy because a few men on a hip hop message board feel women should submit in a relationship is laughable at best and bitchassness at worst. You should get out more.
Anyway I'm off to bed and we'll just agree to disagree.
Of course I'm sure you'll have the last word.
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Word. Shorty actin like "patriarchy" brought us to some type of apocalyptic world where everything is ? up.
I don't know what she's talking about but life is good. Humans are in a much better place than we were centuries ago. Still a lot to work on but quit being so damn dramatic b. -
Interesting.
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Wow, interesting thread. Learned a lot of stuff in here. Couldn't help but add my own $.02.
I feel like this... any and every ideology is subject to corruption. There is no right or wrong, but it can be pushed either way, depending on who's running it. We gotta look into ourselves for how to live and not what society dictates, cuz life is more complex than a tablet of commandments, a doctrine of mental disorders, or a Beyonce song.
Look at the current situation at hand. We cannot afford to bicker about who runs the house when we can barely keep roofs over our heads. One hand washes the other, both hands wash the face, or something like that. Meaning, in a family, both partners gotta respect, honor and listen to (obey sounds too old school) each other. But both partners also have to hold down the household (the face). Even if that means you have to play and switch "roles".
Like, I never seen anything wrong with being a homemaker and caregiver. Like someone said earlier, the hand that rocks the cradle rules the world. In a patriarchal society, that would be a woman's job. But say for example, a man loses his job and his wife happens to have one. He would have to shoulder the weight of taking care of the house til he gets back on his feet, and vice versa with the wife. No egos and ideologies involved, just a matter of doing what you can to keep the family together and sustained. Ideology feeds the ego of whoever it benefits, and pushes away whoever it doesn't. If we kept our egos and followed ideologies to the tee, we would fail. Period.
On to the topic at hand, T/S is a perfect example of someone whose ego keeps her trapped in ideology (no offense). Love will not survive on ego, and it goes both ways. If you feel like dude is controlling you, let him know how you feeling without attacking him with that same energy, or simply leave. But at the same time, if you can't put aside your own ego and cater to the dude's needs, then the relationship won't last. If you feel that changing the channel is too much to do, then don't drag this thing another minute, let alone another 2 months or however long, cuz neither of you will grow as individuals and it'll be a vicious cycle of mental battles. You as a person are more important than a relationship, especially one as shallow as one where fights are started over the remote. -
ReppinTime wrote: »
I don't give a ? if two ? men or two ? women can't produce a child.
The very idea that child breeding makes you biologically superior sounds dumb.
The very idea that producing children makes you superior is a symptom of patriarchal/sexist thinking.
You sound stupid you lunatic fat ? . You aint even trying to be logical you too busy jamming toaster strudels in your fat mouth and typing dumb ? with the free hand.
? the idea that producing children makes you superior is a symptom of REALITY. Come back to it and out of orbit you mammoth. People learned not from sexism but from NATURE that ? the opposite sex and having children is superior to boys ? boys and the species going EXTINCT. Its SURVIVAL, the number one imperative of every species on the planet.
You MUTANTS cannot live and survive self contained, you NEED heterosexual behavior which makes your mutant behavior the INFERIOR one and evolutionarily backward, ? . If we rounded you ? fat ? up and stuck you in a time machine your ? tribe would go extinct in a generation and the smart ones would leave you and be ? and sucking every ? they could find. ? are not NEEDED for the human species to survive, heterosexuals are, thats reality not ? "sexist thinking". You sound like the ? dodo bird trying to tell humans why we equals. ugh ? go live in alaska
All that ranting and I ain't read ? .
Your opinion became a joke to me when you couldn't back up your idiotic accusation about feminism being a plot by the CIA with any evidence.
Really, I was over you 7 pages ago.
Wow what a great argument. -
idk how we got here
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@affiliatemoney101 I'm glad you let it go too. You can't have a logical, mature debate with emotional, immature people. And they kind of exposed themselves anyway. They don't believe in equality, they believe women should rule. My former supervisor had 2 things to day about that:
1. Many claim they want equality, when they actually want to be the ones in power.
2. Everyone wants to be equal, until they find out TRULY being equal sucks. -
Not even trying to throw shade, but I think we should let @lilloca and @sixsicksins have all the responsibilities of a man(a real man not a rolling stone dead beat drunkard) and give them a peer review at the end of the month. Then we'll find out how much they like the idea of being equal on everything. There's a reason why men age much worse than women do, something called stress.
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dallas' 4 eva wrote: »Not even trying to throw shade, but I think we should let @lilloca and @sixsicksins have all the responsibilities of a man(a real man not a rolling stone dead beat drunkard) and give them a peer review at the end of the month. Then we'll find out how much they like the idea of being equal on everything. There's a reason why men age much worse than women do, something called stress. eat each other, call it whine and whine
cs
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dallas' 4 eva wrote: »Not even trying to throw shade, but I think we should let @lilloca and @sixsicksins have all the responsibilities of a man(a real man not a rolling stone dead beat drunkard) and give them a peer review at the end of the month. Then we'll find out how much they like the idea of being equal on everything. There's a reason why men age much worse than women do, something called stress.
We have just as much stress. And, of course, on an individual basis either man or woman may have more or less...but in general I'd say it is even.
You bring up an interesting topic. There was a neat show being documented called "The Week the Women Left" or something like that. The men were left to do everything that comprises a typical female gender role. It was interesting indeed. Most men wouldn't partake in such a study though because of their fragile egos. But to imply we don't have stress or even that we have less in general is absurd. -
affiliatemoney101 wrote: »Just a question, and I've only skimmed thru the pages so I ain't catch everything. But when you say that the idea of women submitting comes from religious views and Christian ethics, how can you explain the idea of submission in a country like India or Thailand where their societies date thousands of years before Christianity even existed? Or any other non-Christian country around the world?
Prior to the beginning of patriarchy, women centered religions existed in many parts of the world: India, Canaan, Egypt, Western Europe, Australia, and other parts of Africa. With food production, settlement strategies, and invasion, patriarchal beliefs and female submission were introduced to people in India and Thailand through the form of male centered religion.
So what was it before the centered religions?
Goddess religions are the oldest forms of worship that existed before patriarchal religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam), as I understand it.
So do you think the world would be a better place with goddess worship and matriarchy?
Not really a religious person. But I'd take goddess worship over having a masculine ? that promotes war, heterosexism, and intolerance.
Yes, basically, to your question.
Wouldn't that be putting women over men and contradicting the whole equal on every level thing though?
Not really.
Homosexuality, trangendered people, and women exercised greater freedom under a woman centered religions, but men didn't suffer from it. Societies were more sex positive and sexuality wasn't limited to marriage. In fact, I'd say that more men probably enjoyed a greater amount of freedom and less superficial social restrictions.
It's still themed around one gender though, so that's not equal...you didn't say a diety w/o a gender you specifically are stating a woman and the inherent qualities that come with being a woman to be placed not on the same level as men, but on a level above so even if it would lead to what you're saying it's still not equality because men and women's values still aren't being held to the same level. You're still wrong because you keep focusing on sexuality when that is not the only part of a religion. What about morals, ethics? Something that extends beyond same sex couple being able to live w/o prejudice? If that's the only or main goal that ? is stupid because, and this is from a straight man that actually supports homosexual rights, you need more than the promise to ? who you want to maintain a religion -
affiliatemoney101 wrote: »So besides sexual liberation which does nothing for children and it actually risky due to STD's, what does matriarchy promote that can build a society that can not get trampled over from another society. Under patriarchy we had inventions, industrial breakthroughs, scientific breakthroughs etc I have no doubt that women possess the same capabilities in fact a woman invented the synthesis of creating petroleum. Anyway I feel that there is good or bad to patriarchy or matriarchy based on the underlying factor that they are people based and as we all know through interacting with people, that people are terribly flawed.
Under patriarchy, you have war, destructive capitalism, racial hierarchies, classism, slavery, environmental degradation and other forms of oppression.
It's basically a system of ? and ? people over.
As for the alternatives that matriarchy could provide, I couldn't tell you, since there are no recorded unambiguous matriarchies on record. I'm just talking about how I think people could learn from the time when we had Goddess religions that promoted acceptance and respecting humanity.
Why you would think patriarchy is productive and better for the world, I have no idea.
There actually are some matriarchal societies that do exist, they have been studied and recorded...all the ? you're talking about happens due to patriarchy is simply attempts to maintain power. You think women in power wouldn't fight just as hard to maintain their position? A person in power is going to have their position challenged...you think simply being in a matriarchal society will prevent that? Or lessen the things a person will go through to get that power? Women now already can't work together at ? Macy's w/o tearing each other's head off over who sells the most perfume a month...
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SixSickSins wrote: »So you just ignore him saying when his wife has more information he defers to her and she does the same...also known as the "whoever has the best idea, that's what we rolling with as a team" philosophy...yeah you're too caught up on the word submission...and just so you know, a man calling women ? and hoes doesn't mean he values women any less..it just means he values THOSE women less...trust most men has a list of women he'd have to be pushed to a breaking point to call a ? or a hoe...if you ain't on that list for the men you're around oh well
I didn't ignore that portion. However, I addressed the fact that overall he feels he has the final say. So I guess you ignored him saying "at the end of the day I'm still king"....this is the aspect we're discussing...this "overall" aspect. Already said I wasn't caught up on any word; I do not like the concept. Please read before you say that anyone else is ignoring a post or any portion thereof, thanks
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And, just so you know, some of these men call the women they're with that.
Then those women fall under the category I listed wouldn't they? So what he said he's still king...he also said his wife is still Queen...did you miss that or do you somehow inherently value a king's role more than a queen so even when somebody is telling you they value them the same you can't get past your own mental block to see "Maybe the definition is more fluid than I give it credit for"...If you weren't so caught up on the word then you'd be able to see the context it's being discussed in and you'd see you're not even half right you're just wrong -
Don't ya'll believe Eve was from created from Adam's rib, or some ? ?.. I expect the big piece of chicken when I get home from a hard days work.. that's all I'm saying..
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SixSickSins wrote: »dallas' 4 eva wrote: »Not even trying to throw shade, but I think we should let @lilloca and @sixsicksins have all the responsibilities of a man(a real man not a rolling stone dead beat drunkard) and give them a peer review at the end of the month. Then we'll find out how much they like the idea of being equal on everything. There's a reason why men age much worse than women do, something called stress.
We have just as much stress. And, of course, on an individual basis either man or woman may have more or less...but in general I'd say it is even.
You bring up an interesting topic. There was a neat show being documented called "The Week the Women Left" or something like that. The men were left to do everything that comprises a typical female gender role. It was interesting indeed. Most men wouldn't partake in such a study though because of their fragile egos. But to imply we don't have stress or even that we have less in general is absurd.
My mama taught me how to cook, sew, and all that other good ? when I was a kid. She always told me to never wait for a woman to do it because in her own words 'you can't depend on a woman to do for you because once they feel like they have to do too much, even if it's a little she'll up and leave.'
From my experiences she was right too. -
wtf did this thread turn into? back on topic.....
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smh @ 89 new replies overnight....
i spent my saturday night feeling like a man. -
Good to see actual intelligent conversation on this board, so many paragraphs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FgMLROTqJ0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZHObW7iUus
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